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Thread: Trump Threatens To Cut Off Aid To "Palestinians"

  1. #61
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    I never claimed Jews were superior human beings, sir. I am acquainted with Myer Lansky, Bugsy Seigel, Bernie Madoff, etc.

    WWII is not ancient history. If my father had lived his normal lifespan, he'd still be with us. He was a vet of the Pacific Theater, and my guess is, most adults and children who lived through WWII are still alive.

    I can't really understand your point. That the Russian Revolution involved much hideous suffering? I don't deny that. So did the Chinese revolution and the Cuban revolution. But I only know actual survivors of the Cuban revolution.

    I don't know what to do to make anyone in Eastern Europe or Russia suffer less injustice today.

    I DO know what to do to protect Israelis, and I do what I can.

    My first loyalty remains my own community, where Jews are thriving and nobody openly hates people of Eastern European descent, but my black neighbors have no justice even when their children are murdered by the police.

    I do what I can, which should not mean I am to be despised for not doing more.

    We have a killing freeze here, going into its second week. 4 homeless people have died in the cold. I have neighbors who won't do fuck all for homeless people, but who are down at the shore of Lake Erie, rescuing ducks.

    Ducks! Not as if they are an endangered species -- they just can't bear for them to suffer and do nothing.

    So, when I want to fight homelessness here, do I start by bashing my duck-loving neighbors, or the fuckweasles that run Cleveland?
    My point was that Jews, at least, ethnic Jews, were leaders of those forces that perpetrated those horrors after the Revolution. It's easy to just talk about the Holocaust and position them simply as victims. But, in Russia, they were also perpetrators, back then, that too is a historic fact. It was even a Jew who oversaw the murder of the Tsar and his family: Did the Jews kill the Tsar?

    Though, I, again, think the attempt to blame the entire religion is ludicrous.

    But, all that did also happen.

    And at least one of Stalin's NKVD secret police chiefs was also of Jewish background, btw: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genrikh_Yagoda

    If we are gonna get into that...
    Last edited by The Man; 3rd January 2018 at 02:42 PM.
    Thanks from Madeline

  2. #62
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    My point was that Jews, at least, ethnic Jews, were leaders of those forces that perpetrated those horrors after the Revolution. It's easy to just talk about the Holocaust and position them simply as victims. But, in Russia, they were also perpetrators, back then, that too is a historic fact. It was even a Jew who oversaw the murder of the Tsar and his family: Did the Jews kill the Tsar?

    Though, I, again, think the attempt to blame the entire religion is ludicrous.

    But, all that did also happen.

    And at least one of Stalin's NKVD secret police chiefs was also of Jewish background, btw: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genrikh_Yagoda

    If we are gonna get into that...
    There were Jews who collaborated with the Nazis, too. This is not a group of humans free of sins that the rest of commit.

    They aren't special because they're better than us. They're special because they could never trust their lives to even one host country. Not ONE, in 5,000 years.

    The ONLY safety Jews will ever know lies with Israel.
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  3. #63
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    There were Jews who collaborated with the Nazis, too. This is not a group of humans free of sins that the rest of commit.

    They aren't special because they're better than us. They're special because they could never trust their lives to even one host country. Not ONE, in 5,000 years.

    The ONLY safety Jews will ever know lies with Israel.
    They are an interesting lot, I will give you that.

    Today in Russia, on one hand, as I said before, many, possibly even majority (I can't say for sure, because plenty of them hide their identity behind Slavic names lol) of the oligarchs, Putin's crony billionaires, are Jews. Plenty of high-ranking people in the regime also.

    Yet, many of the best known opposition leaders are Jews also. Boris Nemtsov, who was murdered couple years ago, was of Jewish background too.

    Very, very complicated over there...
    Thanks from Madeline

  4. #64
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    The West insists on going along with Israel to cut [the Palestinians] off from everywhere. And then, complains when they resort to violence and "extremism" and make friebds with Iran and such, to fucking survive...
    Except that the extremism / terrorism started before this talk of cutting off funding - which is going to terrorism and other military hardware and operations designed to harm Jewish civilians. They want all the Jews gone, and are making friends with Iran not to survive, but because Iran (or, at least, the Iranian government) also wants the region cleansed of Jews.
    Thanks from Madeline

  5. #65
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    West Bank and Gaza and Golan are NOT Israel.
    They are not a country called Palestine, either, nor has either ever belonged to such a country. Those lands came from Jordan, Egypt and Syria, respectively.
    Thanks from Madeline

  6. #66
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    Perhaps the Palestinians should figure out what Egypt did to convince Israel to give up [the Sinai peninsula].
    They know what Egypt did - agreed to peace. Hamas and the PA are unwilling to do that.
    Thanks from Madeline and Djinn

  7. #67
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    What do you know about how "Arab Israelis" think?

    You are just repeating the Zionist propaganda, without your own thought.

    Disappointing, really.

    And, no. West Bank and Gaza and Golan are NOT Israel. Whether you or your Jewish friends like it or not, Israel is recognized by the UN as an occupier state. It occupies WB and Golan just as Russia is considered to occupy Crimea.
    There have been scientifically sound surveys, as well as protracted legislative activity in the Knesset, in which such people appeared and testified.

    How would I know what anyone else thinks? They said so.

    You seem surprised that Arab Israelis do not yearn for different citizenship, but nowhere in the Muslim world would they have the same freedom, opportunity or security. There's no Muslim nation that protects even the most fundamental rights of women. None has the standard of living that Israel has, and none with Western-style justice, including due process.

    Do you still expect people to demand to be sent backwards in time, oppressed, exploited, their children's futures damaged?

    I certainly do not. IMO, ordinary Arabs living in Israel want what people anywhere want: a good job, a nice home, and hope of a future for their kids.

    O, and I have no fucks to give over the U.N.'s opinions. They've been nothing but a mouthpiece for Arab terrorists for over a decade.
    Last edited by Madeline; 3rd January 2018 at 03:54 PM.

  8. #68
    Veteran Member Southern Dad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    When did Israel show any willingness for a two state solution?
    When did the Palestinians? Remember, the all or nothing? And to answer your question, 2009.
    Thanks from Ian Jeffrey, Madeline and The Man

  9. #69
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Dad View Post
    When did the Palestinians? Remember, the all or nothing? And to answer your question, 2009.
    Among other occasions.

  10. #70
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    I never claimed Jews were superior human beings, sir. ...
    In all fairness, I'm a superior human being. Though I'm having a hell of a time convincing my wife to recognize me as such.

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