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Thread: with regards to the sometimes offered statement that African Americans were better

  1. #31
    New Member Barbella's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmanmcfly View Post
    Yes, there was a huge difference... Slaves were considered property. If there was a choice to make its the property that would be fed and the chattel allowed to starve.

    Anyway, if you won't accept a book written on the subject, the extent of research you will be required to do, you'll have enough To write your own book.
    Some people here are apparently loath to accept the uncomfortable truth if it doesn't benefit their agenda. Sad.

  2. #32
    Veteran Member PACE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barbella View Post
    Some people here are apparently loath to accept the uncomfortable truth if it doesn't benefit their agenda. Sad.
    You didn't research well enough, read the posts here.

  3. #33
    Veteran Member PACE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barbella View Post
    Look harder...

    The Irish slave trade began when 30,000 Irish prisoners were sold as slaves to the New World. The King James I Proclamation of 1625 required Irish political prisoners be sent overseas and sold to English settlers in the West Indies. By the mid 1600s, the Irish were the main slaves sold to Antigua and Montserrat. At that time, 70% of the total population of Montserrat were Irish slaves.

    Ireland quickly became the biggest source of human livestock for English merchants. The majority of the early slaves to the New World were actually white.

    From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English and another 300,000 were sold as slaves. Ireland’s population fell from about 1,500,000 to 600,000 in one single decade. Families were ripped apart as the British did not allow Irish dads to take their wives and children with them across the Atlantic. This led to a helpless population of homeless women and children. Britain’s solution was to auction them off as well.

    During the 1650s, over 100,000 Irish children between the ages of 10 and 14 were taken from their parents and sold as slaves in the West Indies, Virginia and New England. In this decade, 52,000 Irish (mostly women and children) were sold to Barbados and Virginia. Another 30,000 Irish men and women were also transported and sold to the highest bidder. In 1656, Cromwell ordered that 2000 Irish children be taken to Jamaica and sold as slaves to English settlers.

    Many people today will avoid calling the Irish slaves what they truly were: Slaves. They’ll come up with terms like “Indentured Servants” to describe what occurred to the Irish. However, in most cases from the 17th and 18th centuries, Irish slaves were nothing more than human cattle.

    As an example, the African slave trade was just beginning during this same period. It is well recorded that African slaves, not tainted with the stain of the hated Catholic theology and more expensive to purchase, were often treated far better than their Irish counterparts.

    African slaves were very expensive during the late 1600s (50 Sterling). Irish slaves came cheap (no more than 5 Sterling). If a planter whipped or branded or beat an Irish slave to death, it was never a crime. A death was a monetary setback, but far cheaper than killing a more expensive African. The English masters quickly began breeding the Irish women for both their own personal pleasure and for greater profit. Children of slaves were themselves slaves, which increased the size of the master’s free workforce. Even if an Irish woman somehow obtained her freedom, her kids would remain slaves of her master. Thus, Irish moms, even with this new found emancipation, would seldom abandon their kids and would remain in servitude.

    In time, the English thought of a better way to use these women (in many cases, girls as young as 12) to increase their market share: The settlers began to breed Irish women and girls with African men to produce slaves with a distinct complexion. These new “mulatto” slaves brought a higher price than Irish livestock and, likewise, enabled the settlers to save money rather than purchase new African slaves. This practice of interbreeding Irish females with African men went on for several decades and was so widespread that, in 1681, legislation was passed “forbidding the practice of mating Irish slave women to African slave men for the purpose of producing slaves for sale.” In short, it was stopped only because it interfered with the profits of a large slave transport company.

    England continued to ship tens of thousands of Irish slaves for more than a century. Records state that, after the 1798 Irish Rebellion, thousands of Irish slaves were sold to both America and Australia. There were horrible abuses of both African and Irish captives. One British ship even dumped 1,302 slaves into the Atlantic Ocean so that the crew would have plenty of food to eat.

    There is little question that the Irish experienced the horrors of slavery as much (if not more in the 17th Century) as the Africans did. There is, also, very little question that those brown, tanned faces you witness in your travels to the West Indies are very likely a combination of African and Irish ancestry. In 1839, Britain finally decided on its own to end its participation in Satan’s highway to hell and stopped transporting slaves. While their decision did not stop pirates from doing what they desired, the new law slowly concluded THIS chapter of nightmarish Irish misery.

    But, if anyone, black or white, believes that slavery was only an African experience, then they’ve got it completely wrong.

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-ir...e-slaves/31076
    We don't care about Europe, we care about America, and why the south has failed every since slavery was abolished, now, please once again, read the comments here, your conclusion is wrong,

    Not right, wrong

  4. #34
    New Member Barbella's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PACE View Post
    We don't care about Europe, we care about America, and why the south has failed every since slavery was abolished, now, please once again, read the comments here, your conclusion is wrong,

    Not right, wrong
    The whole point is that slavery is wrong no matter what the skin color is. So many people of ALL races were (and still are) enslaved, yet the only ones who are still screaming about AMERICAN slavery (that ended over 150 years ago) are AFRICAN AMERICANS who, themselves, were NEVER slaves.

    THAT'S the point. People who are STILL playing the victims, complaining about their ancestors being slaves, and who expect, to this day, to be treated preferentially and looking for some kind of 'reparation' are nothing but losers. I don't see the Irish, or the Chinese, or any other group of people who were mistreated as well looking for ANYTHING. They are WINNERS.
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  5. #35
    Veteran Member PACE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barbella View Post
    The whole point is that slavery is wrong no matter what the skin color is. So many people of ALL races were (and still are) enslaved, yet the only ones who are still screaming about AMERICAN slavery (that ended over 150 years ago) are AFRICAN AMERICANS who, themselves, were NEVER slaves.

    THAT'S the point. People who are STILL playing the victims, complaining about their ancestors being slaves, and who expect, to this day, to be treated preferentially and looking for some kind of 'reparation' are nothing but losers. I don't see the Irish, or the Chinese, or any other group of people who were mistreated as well looking for ANYTHING. They are WINNERS.
    You completely missed the point of the top post, which is not surprising, as your agenda is clear. This post is about why the south is STILL in failure mode post the civil war and the abolishment of slavery, it is economic and health related in nature, now, you can either address that or you can continue to talk about your "agenda", but I suggest, strongly you start your own thread on it.

    Your comments about slavery, are wildly obsfucating in nature; this is about whether the south will 'wake up" "grow up" and start paying it's own way, to date, it has not, we subsidize the south, for every dollar Kentucky sends to the feds, they get 1.28 back, Ct? gets .68 cents back, Really it's time for them to grow out of the 19th century, and for the record?

    We can go back to ancient times and bring up the Jewish people who were enslaved by the Eygptians and other epochs of history, that is not what this thread is about.

    Stop derailing it.

  6. #36
    Veteran Member bmanmcfly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RNG View Post
    Chattel are property. Slaves are an example of chattel. Indentured servants were not legally property. As I said, a big difference.
    Sorry, semantics... "Indentured servitude" is a long term to type several times in a paragraph.

    But the effect is the same, the property would be given better treatment than the "debt".
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  7. #37
    Veteran Member bmanmcfly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PACE View Post
    We don't care about Europe, we care about America, and why the south has failed every since slavery was abolished, now, please once again, read the comments here, your conclusion is wrong,

    Not right, wrong
    Umm... Where do you think Americans lived in the 1600's?
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  8. #38
    Veteran Member PACE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmanmcfly View Post
    Sorry, semantics... "Indentured servitude" is a long term to type several times in a paragraph.

    But the effect is the same, the property would be given better treatment than the "debt".
    Nope, it's not

    Slavery = property

    Indentured servitude = pay back, but not property.
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  9. #39
    New Member Barbella's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PACE View Post
    You completely missed the point of the top post, which is not surprising, as your agenda is clear. This post is about why the south is STILL in failure mode post the civil war and the abolishment of slavery, it is economic and health related in nature, now, you can either address that or you can continue to talk about your "agenda", but I suggest, strongly you start your own thread on it.

    Your comments about slavery, are wildly obsfucating in nature; this is about whether the south will 'wake up" "grow up" and start paying it's own way, to date, it has not, we subsidize the south, for every dollar Kentucky sends to the feds, they get 1.28 back, Ct? gets .68 cents back, Really it's time for them to grow out of the 19th century, and for the record?

    We can go back to ancient times and bring up the Jewish people who were enslaved by the Eygptians and other epochs of history, that is not what this thread is about.

    Stop derailing it.
    Oh, please... re-read your own top post, dammit! The whole thing is about how bad African Americans had it because of Southern slavery. Nothing was said about federal dollars being sent to southern states. Who do you think your'e dealing with... an idiot? Is that what you're used to doing here?

  10. #40
    Veteran Member bmanmcfly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barbella View Post
    The whole point is that slavery is wrong no matter what the skin color is. So many people of ALL races were (and still are) enslaved, yet the only ones who are still screaming about AMERICAN slavery (that ended over 150 years ago) are AFRICAN AMERICANS who, themselves, were NEVER slaves.

    THAT'S the point. People who are STILL playing the victims, complaining about their ancestors being slaves, and who expect, to this day, to be treated preferentially and looking for some kind of 'reparation' are nothing but losers. I don't see the Irish, or the Chinese, or any other group of people who were mistreated as well looking for ANYTHING. They are WINNERS.
    We should be hearing about the oppressed Japanese who were literally robbed and kept in concentration camps, or the Jews who were almost genocided... Somehow those groups have managed to move on and exception being a discussion on that specific topic, you won't ever hear anyone from those groups complaining.

    Also, both those groups actually perform better than white people on average.

    I suppose with the binary world view of so many that will make me an Asian-Jewish supremacist...
    Thanks from Barbella

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