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Thread: Is race a social construct?

  1. #41
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OlGuy View Post
    Oh yes there has to be a single ancestor. But what prompted this topic for me was recalling Stalin's thought of combining Chimpanzees and humans to make a soldier. A perfidious idea and enough said on the subject.
    We could VERY easily create a human/chimpanzee chimera. It would be a VERY fascinating and VERY unethical scientific experiment.

    Which means that someone WILL do it someday.
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  2. #42
    olguy OlGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLeRoy View Post
    We could VERY easily create a human/chimpanzee chimera. It would be a VERY fascinating and VERY unethical scientific experiment.

    Which means that someone WILL do it someday.
    The future may end up looking like a Tolkien novel, or Planet of the Apes?
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  3. #43
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy View Post
    Speaking for myself, I could easily rid myself of the idea. So I'm not sure why it would be difficult for others to do so as well.
    Because our society and history has been built (among other things, of course) around the very racism many purport to deny exists (anymore). We cannot simply pretend it did not and/or does not exist. Yes, discriminating against people based on skin color is as absurd as basing it on eye color, yet people did the former, and still do it.
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  4. #44
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLeRoy View Post
    We have reason to think that there may have been, though, as recently as just 12,000 years ago, at just the end of the last Ice Age. Careful analysis of the human genome is revealing signals that there may have been more 'primitive' hominids still living at that time in such locations as West Africa, the western part of China, and possibly in island Southeast Asia. The story of human evolution is becoming more and more fascinating. See the latest issue of New Scientist magazine, if you have access to it, for a very interesting article on this.
    IIRC, Cro-Magnon and Neatherthals co-existed in Europe.
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  5. #45
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    It does, IF the speaker asserts there is a biological science basis for classifying humans this way.
    Not really, no. Even separate species have variations within the species. It is those variations around which "race" is constructed.

  6. #46
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    Not really, no. Even separate species have variations within the species. It is those variations around which "race" is constructed.
    Agreed, except the differentiation among groups of humans seems to be far less than between other subspecies of mammals.

    Bottom line is, "racial identity" matters more to humans than simple biology would suggest is rational.

  7. #47
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLeRoy View Post
    We could VERY easily create a human/chimpanzee chimera. It would be a VERY fascinating and VERY unethical scientific experiment.

    Which means that someone WILL do it someday.
    Wait....whut? A human egg could be inseminated by gorilla (or some other ape) sperm?

    That strains credulity.

  8. #48
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    IIRC, Cro-Magnon and Neatherthals co-existed in Europe.
    Yes, they did, and modern humans and Neanderthals certainly interbred; but Neanderthals appeared to be completely gone by about 35,000 years ago----whereas these more recent findings that I am speaking of suggest there were more primitive human relatives still around as recently as ONLY 12 thousand years ago!
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  9. #49
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Wait....whut? A human egg could be inseminated by gorilla (or some other ape) sperm?

    That strains credulity.
    No, not a hybrid, a chimera! For example, scientists have created a geep: an animal where half of the cells are sheep cells and half of the cells are goat cells. It CANNOT reproduce, yet is a functioning organism. I'll go find a link. Here it is:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheep%...93goat_chimera

    I was incorrect in saying that it cannot reproduce!
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  10. #50
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Wait....whut? A human egg could be inseminated by gorilla (or some other ape) sperm?

    That strains credulity.
    The Case for Making Chimp-Humans

    This guy does make a very interesting argument: the nonsensical insistence that human beings are uniquely created in God’s image and endowed with a soul, whereas other living things are mere brutes has not only permitted but encouraged an attitude toward the natural world in general and other animals in particular that has been at best indifferent and more often, downright antagonistic, jingoistic, and in many cases, intolerably cruel. It is only because of this self-serving myth that some people have been able to justify keeping other animals in such hideous conditions as factory farms in which they are literally unable to turn around, not to mention prevented from experiencing anything approaching a fulfilling life. It is only because of this self-serving myth that some people accord the embryos of Homo sapiens a special place as persons-in-waiting, magically endowed with a notable humanity that entitles them to special legal and moral consideration unavailable to our nonhuman kin. It is only because of this self-serving myth that many people have been able to deny the screamingly evident evolutionary connectedness between themselves and other life forms.

    When claims are made about the “right to life,” invariably the referent is human life, a rigid distinction only possible because of the presumption that human life is somehow uniquely distinct from other forms of life, even though everything we know of biology demonstrates that this is simply untrue. What better, clearer, and more unambiguous way to demonstrate this than by creating viable organisms that are neither human nor animal but certifiably intermediate?
    Last edited by BigLeRoy; 6th May 2018 at 11:07 AM.

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