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Thread: Cultural appropriation and art

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by syrenn View Post
    thoughts?


    yeah.... the professionally offended will always find something to be offended and outraged over. I find it amusing they want multiculturalism and "melting pots" but when it comes right down to it... they really dont.
    The concept of a "melting pot" has been completely abandoned because it implies assimilation. What is now advocated is the multicultural "salad bowl" in which the separate ingredients are distinct. The problem with that in a country like ours which admits one million legal immigrants every year, in addition to all the illegals whose presence is tolerated, is that we no longer are incorporating immigrants into a single identity as Americans, but are allowing large numbers of people to live here who have no emotional investment in being American, and who are often here just to game the system, living off the generous benefits that working Americans pay for. How is that good for America and Americans?

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Throttle View Post
    The concept of a "melting pot" has been completely abandoned because it implies assimilation. What is now advocated is the multicultural "salad bowl" in which the separate ingredients are distinct. The problem with that in a country like ours which admits one million legal immigrants every year, in addition to all the illegals whose presence is tolerated, is that we no longer are incorporating immigrants into a single identity as Americans, but are allowing large numbers of people to live here who have no emotional investment in being American, and who are often here just to game the system, living off the generous benefits that working Americans pay for. How is that good for America and Americans?
    They live here, they have kids here, they have jobs here, they pay taxes here, they own property here, they own businesses here, they belong to churches here, their kids go to school here, they have SS benefits accruing that like all of us they won't see till they retire, they have 401K here. They're invested the same as you and me. Just because they can't trace their ancestors back to the Mayflower doesn't mean this place isn't their home.

    You have an expectation of Americanism you don't even hold Americans too. Besides the people in the OP are native Canadians. If native Americans started bitching about cultural appropriation would you whine that they weren't "American" enough?
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  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    More than separate meals. After dairy, I can eat meat in about an hour, some say 1/2 hour & rinse your mouth out first. After meat, there are different opinions, but the prevailing opinion is 6 hours before eating dairy. (Some hold to 4 hours, or even 3. I started out waiting 6, so that's my custom.) Pareve things - i.e., neutral, neither dairy nor meat - can be eaten at any time. Eggs and fish are considered pareve. However, while fish can be eaten at the same meal as meat, it cannot be mixed with meat - i.e., has to be different plate & utensils. With dairy, fish can be combined (hence bagels w/ lox & cream cheese, e.g.).
    Good grief, how do you keep up with all that? And since you guys don't have hell, what's the punishment if you screw up?

  4. #54
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blueneck View Post
    Good grief, how do you keep up with all that?
    Some things can be even worse, too. My part-time roommate is a kashrus rabbi - he inspects facilities to make sure the products are kosher* - and he took me on a couple inspection tours, once. You would not believe the standards food production have to be kept to.

    * For those who have contracted for that ... e.g., did you know that Cheez-Itz are kosher (dairy)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blueneck View Post
    And since you guys don't have hell, what's the punishment if you screw up?
    Jews generally are not motivated on a reward/punishment system, even though we know both exist. We are more motivated by what is right and what is wrong, and that doing what is right is its own reward. (That generally holds for non-observant Jews, too, just dealing with some different issues.) With Orthodox Jews, we know that doing what is right is spiritually elevating, and what is not right is spiritually degrading, and so we are motivated by that, too.
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  5. #55
    Veteran Member cpicturetaker12's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by webrockk View Post
    'The Melting Pot' is passť. long ago replaced with 'celebrating diversity'. It all stems from Identity/Victim-Oppressor politics. It's more difficult to pander to victimhood and gin up hate for 'oppressors' when we identify as a citizen.

    Everybody has to be made to believe everybody's gettin' over on everybody else, or it all falls apart.
    Okay folks. That's it, no more discussion. No victims allowed. Oppress away. Apparently citizens can't be oppresors? Or is it that victim's can't be citizens?

  6. #56
    Veteran Member Dr.Knuckles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Throttle View Post
    The concept of a "melting pot" has been completely abandoned because it implies assimilation. What is now advocated is the multicultural "salad bowl" in which the separate ingredients are distinct. The problem with that in a country like ours which admits one million legal immigrants every year, in addition to all the illegals whose presence is tolerated, is that we no longer are incorporating immigrants into a single identity as Americans, but are allowing large numbers of people to live here who have no emotional investment in being American, and who are often here just to game the system, living off the generous benefits that working Americans pay for. How is that good for America and Americans?
    While this concept is happening now in the US, it has been happening here for three generations. Your question is valid. Will you listen to the answer?

    It benefits the host nation because those millions of immigrants settle and are... here's the key part... happy.

    They thrive. Granny speaks the home language, mum struggles with English and the little daughter is fluent in both. The family functions in the home, and in public differently, but it functions in both places. No one is angry. No one is humiliated. No one is excluded. They interact with neighbors and they learn slowly.

    In 20 years, granny is in the grave, mom is now living in both worlds, and daughter has married outside the culture. She and her husband delivered a baby and that baby is 10% her culture, 10% his, and 80% Canadian - or American in your case.

    25 years after that, that kid's kid only speaks English and has no real connection to their roots.

    That's how our forefathers did it. That's the truth. We just don't remember because we're that kids kid.

    In my grandpas time there were entire towns of German, Swedish, French, Portuguese speakers. Where only the kids spoke English.

    Niw theyre all gone. Even though no one ever forced them to change.
    Last edited by Dr.Knuckles; 18th May 2017 at 10:31 PM.

  7. #57
    Veteran Member Dr.Knuckles's Avatar
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    Who in 1960 could have even possibly conceived of a half black President.

    People adjust if everyone just chills the fuck out and lets them.
    Thanks from Blueneck, Ian Jeffrey and The Man

  8. #58
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.Knuckles View Post
    While this concept is happening now in the US, it has been happening here for three generations. Your question is valid. Will you listen to the answer?

    It benefits the host nation because those millions of immigrants settle and are... here's the key part... happy.

    They thrive. Granny speaks the home language, mum struggles with English and the little daughter is fluent in both. The family functions in the home, and in public differently, but it functions in both places. No one is angry. No one is humiliated. No one is excluded. They interact with neighbors and they learn slowly.

    In 20 years, granny is in the grave, mom is now living in both worlds, and daughter has married outside the culture. She and her husband delivered a baby and that baby is 10% her culture, 10% his, and 80% Canadian - or American in your case.

    25 years after that, that kid's kid only speaks English and has no real connection to their roots.

    That's how our forefathers did it. That's the truth. We just don't remember because we're that kids kid.

    In my grandpas time there were entire towns of German, Swedish, French, Portuguese speakers. Where only the kids spoke English.

    Niw theyre all gone. Even though no one ever forced them to change.
    My great-grandfather and his wife and the first two kids came here from the old country (the rest of the kids were born in the U.S.) - speaking Polish, Lithuanian, Yiddish and learning English at some point. They only spoke Yiddish when they were having a conversation they didn't want the kids to understand. They were also religious Jews, though they did not pass this on to the kids. Three generations later, I and maybe one first cousin are the only ones who are religious anymore, and I didn't learn it from the family (my ggf died when I was about 1-1/2 years old). Somehow, everyone until my generation managed to marry Jewish, though.
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  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.Knuckles View Post
    While this concept is happening now in the US, it has been happening here for three generations. Your question is valid. Will you listen to the answer?

    It benefits the host nation because those millions of immigrants settle and are... here's the key part... happy.

    They thrive. Granny speaks the home language, mum struggles with English and the little daughter is fluent in both. The family functions in the home, and in public differently, but it functions in both places. No one is angry. No one is humiliated. No one is excluded. They interact with neighbors and they learn slowly.

    In 20 years, granny is in the grave, mom is now living in both worlds, and daughter has married outside the culture. She and her husband delivered a baby and that baby is 10% her culture, 10% his, and 80% Canadian - or American in your case.

    25 years after that, that kid's kid only speaks English and has no real connection to their roots.

    That's how our forefathers did it. That's the truth. We just don't remember because we're that kids kid.

    In my grandpas time there were entire towns of German, Swedish, French, Portuguese speakers. Where only the kids spoke English.

    Niw theyre all gone. Even though no one ever forced them to change.
    There's a whole mythology regarding American immigration pre-1920 that just doesn't comport to historical reality.

  10. #60
    Veteran Member Dr.Knuckles's Avatar
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    Just think of Mike Meyers. The comedian. Ontario kid but Scottish roots.

    Does the "If its not Scottish it's crap" routine on SNL. Based on his family. Makes "So I married an ax murderer" acting as all the Scottish family to his character "Heath, pants, now", "light a match". Then does Fat Bastard as a Scottish Charicature. Then does Shrek with a Scottish accent.

    He's not from Scotland. He's a Leafs fan. Canadian legend. But it's a part of him.


    That's what it should be.
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