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Thread: "Transgender Chechen" comes forward (in US)

  1. #11
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spookycolt View Post
    You can't assume there are the same percentages of gays in all regions while claiming that there are other genetic differences based on region.

    True redheads run about the same percentage as homosexuals yet they seem to only dominate certain regions.

    You don't see many coming out of Africa so to say that Chechnya has the same amount of gays is just a silly argument.
    It's not a one to one comparison, no. For starters, it is fair to assume that fewer trans and gay people reproduce than do others in the group, which mathematically should tend to reduce the total percents of either type of humans in any group, across time -- and it doesn't appear to do so. For another, the data actually is very limited, as you point out -- but what data exists tends to support my assertions.

    And that's hardly the end of it. We can observe sexual behavior (or tally what behaviors are reported), but we cannot observe the operation of another person's mind. How does a trans person born into a Stone Age culture describe themselves? How do they express their transsexuality?

    It's extremely complex, and nobody yet knows exactly how genetics is involved, or at least, not entirely. But nonetheless, what we do know strongly suggests that gays and trans people are present in approximately the same percents in all societies, no matter how repressive they might be.
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  2. #12
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    BTW, a M-2-F sex change operation, even in South America, runs about $20,000, not including the recovery care costs, etc. I suppose the "first Checheneyan trans person" might be able to prove she has had this done, and that she is ethnically Checheneyan, but still.....this story has a distinctly fishy odor to my nose.
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  3. #13
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    BTW, a M-2-F sex change operation, even in South America, runs about $20,000, not including the recovery care costs, etc. I suppose the "first Checheneyan trans person" might be able to prove she has had this done, and that she is ethnically Checheneyan, but still.....this story has a distinctly fishy odor to my nose.
    Well, if s/he had, at one time at least, been high up in government in Chechnya, s/he would be a pretty wealthy person. Chechnya is a very corrupt region. They recieve millions and millions of dollars in federal aid programs every year, still, even now. Regular Chechens barely see any of that money, the regional officials pilfer and plunder it like crazy (I am told it's a similar situation in Crimea now). Those clans in Chechnya, Kadyrovs and others, close to the government and that money, have grown immensely rich from it. In theory, if s/he came out of one if those clans, affording any surgery would not be an issue for such a person.

    Anyway, to your other points, I want to add that many Chechen men, btw, practice polygamy


    2015 wedding in Chechnya of 47 year old high ranking police officer Nazhud Guchigov

    It raised some controversy in Russia, at the time, because some believed the bride, just 17 years old then, was forced into it: Claims of underage girl's forced marriage to police chief in Chechnya unconfirmed - Chechen children's ombudsman

    The girl's age was just one part of the issue; others were more concerned that the guy was already officially married: Controversial wedding in Chechnya sparks outcry over polygamy issue | Russia Beyond The Headlines

    In fact, the woman touching the young bride's elbow in photo above is his older wife.

    Another pic of both of them with one of the hubby's friends, from social media


    There was much outrage about this, even on TV. But it's normal in Chechnya (and some other Muslim regions). They believe Allah allows them up to four wives. Having at least two or more is not at all unusual there; not to say ALL Chechens are polygamous; Ramzan Kadyrov himself has just one wife and seems perfectly happy with that lol


    But others do practice this, yeah. It's illegal, but Moscow also looks the other way on it

    Of course, what this also means, is a deficit of available wives in some Chechen communities. When many men are marrying more than one woman, means less women left for the others. That's why (or, at least, it's one of the major factors) many young Chechens move outside their regions, go to Moscow and elsewhere, hook up with Russian girls. They just plain old don't have enough of their own females haha

    However, most who come out to Moscow, not just from Chechnya, all Caucasians, are those with money, boys from those wealthy clans connected to the government; or those tied to organized crime (or both, it is rather intertwined over there hehe)

    The poor ones have little prospects. Without money, going to other parts of Russia to try to get with girls is pointless. The big reason chicks in Moscow or Saint Petersburg may seek out a fella from Caucasus, is that he would throw cash and gold at her, and driver her around in a Mercedes

    So, those ones, without money and Mercedes, are mostly stuck in their aul (village). With low prospects for ever getting laid, in some cases hehe Wouldn't surprise me if, in some of those villages, they practice homosexuality because there ain't nothing else for them. Like in prison...
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  4. #14
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    Well, if s/he had, at one time at least, been high up in government in Chechnya, s/he would be a pretty wealthy person. Chechnya is a very corrupt region. They recieve millions and millions of dollars in federal aid programs every year, still, even now. Regular Chechens barely see any of that money, the regional officials pilfer and plunder it like crazy (I am told it's a similar situation in Crimea now). Those clans in Chechnya, Kadyrovs and others, close to the government and that money, have grown immensely rich from it. In theory, if s/he came out of one if those clans, affording any surgery would not be an issue for such a person.

    Anyway, to your other points, I want to add that many Chechen men, btw, practice polygamy


    2015 wedding in Chechnya of 47 year old high ranking police officer Nazhud Guchigov

    It raised some controversy in Russia, at the time, because some believed the bride, just 17 years old then, was forced into it: Claims of underage girl's forced marriage to police chief in Chechnya unconfirmed - Chechen children's ombudsman

    The girl's age was just one part of the issue; others were more concerned that the guy was already officially married: Controversial wedding in Chechnya sparks outcry over polygamy issue | Russia Beyond The Headlines

    In fact, the woman touching the young bride's elbow in photo above is his older wife.

    Another pic of both of them with one of the hubby's friends, from social media


    There was much outrage about this, even on TV. But it's normal in Chechnya (and some other Muslim regions). They believe Allah allows them up to four wives. Having at least two or more is not at all unusual there; not to say ALL Chechens are polygamous; Ramzan Kadyrov himself has just one wife and seems perfectly happy with that lol


    But others do practice this, yeah. It's illegal, but Moscow also looks the other way on it

    Of course, what this also means, is a deficit of available wives in some Chechen communities. When many men are marrying more than one woman, means less women left for the others. That's why (or, at least, it's one of the major factors) many young Chechens move outside their regions, go to Moscow and elsewhere, hook up with Russian girls. They just plain old don't have enough of their own females haha

    However, most who come out to Moscow, not just from Chechnya, all Caucasians, are those with money, boys from those wealthy clans connected to the government; or those tied to organized crime (or both, it is rather intertwined over there hehe)

    The poor ones have little prospects. Without money, going to other parts of Russia to try to get with girls is pointless. The big reason chicks in Moscow or Saint Petersburg may seek out a fella from Caucasus, is that he would throw cash and gold at her, and driver her around in a Mercedes

    So, those ones, without money and Mercedes, are mostly stuck in their aul (village). With low prospects for ever getting laid, in some cases hehe Wouldn't surprise me if, in some of those villages, they practice homosexuality because there ain't nothing else for them. Like in prison...
    Maybe. I don't think that's likely, though. Male prisoners literally have no access to women, and live with the highest concentration of sadistic gay men in America. In other cultures where women have become scarce, like China, no measurable uptick in homosexuality has been noted. Prostitution, sex crimes, adultery, migration, yes. But not homosexuality.

    Still, sexual activity is not sexual orientation. It could be that poor rural men commit bestiality more because it helps them cope with forced celibacy.

    You ask some fascinating questions!
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  5. #15
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Maybe. I don't think that's likely, though. Male prisoners literally have no access to women, and live with the highest concentration of sadistic gay men in America. In other cultures where women have become scarce, like China, no measurable uptick in homosexuality has been noted. Prostitution, sex crimes, adultery, migration, yes. But not homosexuality.

    Still, sexual activity is not sexual orientation. It could be that poor rural men commit bestiality more because it helps them cope with forced celibacy.

    You ask some fascinating questions!
    lol About bestiality...

    "Sheep fucker" ("Ovtseyob") or "donkey fucker" ("osloyob") are popular insults by ethnic Russians against people from Chechnya and Dagestan... This above stereotype has much to do with that hehe

    Some douche even called me a sheep fucker once... I was like, I'm from Abkhazia, you dick, not Dagestan, you even seen a sheep in Abkhazia???

    Cows, yeah


    Shit load of cows there, and people tend to just kinda let their cattle roam free, so you would see cows wondering around all over the place, all by themselves




    eating trash off the ground...


    They ain't shy, you know, even come on out onto the beaches, meet and greet the tourists





    Honestly, with better management, Abkhazia could actually be a serious competitor within the beef and dairy market in Russia... But, unfortunately, there is no better management there, at the moment...

    But, anyway, yeah. Bestiality probably is a thing over there in the mountains too, those slurs didn't originate from nothing...
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  6. #16
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    You cannot make a heterosexual man into a homosexual one by any means, including torture. Some fairly large percent of men are bisexual, and could be made to avoid sexual activity with females, MAYBE.

    But actual heterosexual men? No. Not even in prison. They can be forced into homosexual behavior, but not homosexual desire, gratification, etc.

    Sexual orientation is just not mutable.
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    I am. Or was, at least. I can't help it... Just can't wrap my head around the idea of a transgender Chechen... lol My God...
    I guess I don't understand what's humorous. This sounds like a very sad situation to me.
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  8. #18
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leekohler2 View Post
    I guess I don't understand what's humorous. This sounds like a very sad situation to me.
    Sorry... I was trying to picture a transgender Chechen, and what came to my mind was Kadyrov wearing a wig and a dress...

    Look... I never even heard of such things growing up. I actually saw a trans person in real life for first time like, a year ago, at a mall around here. I am still adjusting to it all...

    I totally support that person in the article and wish him/her all the best in life. Glad that s/he is now safe in America
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  9. #19
    ~Standing My Ground~ Sassy's Avatar
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    Something I think it's strange is that when I was a teen and all my friends were party animals we saw Trannies (that is what they were called then, it was not a slur) out in Deep Ellum and none of us judged them. Now they are grown up and adopted their parents conservative Christian 'values' and post rude things on facebook about bathrooms.
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  10. #20
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sassy View Post
    Something I think it's strange is that when I was a teen and all my friends were party animals we saw Trannies (that is what they were called then, it was not a slur) out in Deep Ellum and none of us judged them. Now they are grown up and adopted their parents conservative Christian 'values' and post rude things on facebook about bathrooms.
    Hell, in Russia in the 90s, and early 2000s, before the Orthodox Church rose to its current influence, most people didn't even think much about this issue. In Soviet Union, homosexuality was banned. In 1991, it was decriminalized, after Communism went away. But it wasn't something people talked about even.

    Now, some folks actually organize on own special forums to go beat up gay rights activists at their demonstrations

    And teach their kids to do same


    And my friends over there, I ask them about this and they are like, yeah, that's right, we ain't Europe, we don't want this gay shit on our streets!


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