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Thread: Case of gay couple’s wedding cake heads to Supreme Court

  1. #1231
    Wrinkly Member Dangermouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aboutenough View Post
    Christians believe in God and Atheist believe there is no God, essentially believing in nothing
    Simple nonsense. Atheists believe in one less god than you do, from a choice of thousands.

    I quite like Cernunnos. He has a motorcycle group named after him!

    Last edited by Dangermouse; 2nd August 2017 at 01:39 PM.
    Thanks from Michael J

  2. #1232
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    https://americanhumanist.org/what-is...sm/manifesto1/

    Written right in the middle of forces that created the new deal and the progressive religion, and just because you deny the desire of humanists to replace traditional religions with a new religion does not change the fact that your founders were more honest than you are today.

    The time has come for widespread recognition of the radical changes in religious beliefs throughout the modern world. The time is past for mere revision of traditional attitudes. Science and economic change have disrupted the old beliefs. Religions the world over are under the necessity of coming to terms with new conditions created by a vastly increased knowledge and experience. In every field of human activity, the vital movement is now in the direction of a candid and explicit humanism. In order that religious humanism may be better understood we, the undersigned, desire to make certain affirmations which we believe the facts of our contemporary life demonstrate.
    There is great danger of a final, and we believe fatal, identification of the word religion with doctrines and methods which have lost their significance and which are powerless to solve the problem of human living in the Twentieth Century. Religions have always been means for realizing the highest values of life. Their end has been accomplished through the interpretation of the total environing situation (theology or world view), the sense of values resulting therefrom (goal or ideal), and the technique (cult), established for realizing the satisfactory life. A change in any of these factors results in alteration of the outward forms of religion. This fact explains the changefulness of religions through the centuries. But through all changes religion itself remains constant in its quest for abiding values, an inseparable feature of human life.
    Last edited by kmiller1610; 12th August 2017 at 12:09 AM.

  3. #1233
    Senior Member Michael J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kmiller1610 View Post
    https://americanhumanist.org/what-is...sm/manifesto1/

    Written right in the middle of forces that created the new deal and the progressive religion, and just because you deny the desire of humanists to replace traditional religions with a new religion does not change the fact that your founders were more honest than you are today.
    That doesn't mean atheism is a religion. That article is about humanism, not atheism.

  4. #1234
    Senior Member Michael J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aboutenough View Post
    Right , they are not Christians, but they are forming groups and meeting in buildings like churches.
    By that logic, any community of interest is therefore a religion exclusively because they have meetings and form groups. The Robocop fan page on Facebook that I'm a part of is a religion. The Democratic and Republican parties are religions. Even Public Citizen is a religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by aboutenough View Post
    like churches.
    I played at a piano recital that was held in a church when I was eight years old. That event had nothing at all to do with religion.

  5. #1235
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael J View Post
    That doesn't mean atheism is a religion. That article is about humanism, not atheism.
    The article is about how there is no difference between religion and any world view that provides the "means for realizing the highest values of life. "

    This is why so many atheists assert that their morality is founded in the Greek views on philosophy.

    Believing in the absence of God requires faith because you can't prove it. Whereas agnosticism can't be a religion because simple doubt does not require faith at all.

  6. #1236
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    Quote Originally Posted by kmiller1610 View Post
    The article is about how there is no difference between religion and any world view that provides the "means for realizing the highest values of life. "

    This is why so many atheists assert that their morality is founded in the Greek views on philosophy.

    Believing in the absence of God requires faith because you can't prove it. Whereas agnosticism can't be a religion because simple doubt does not require faith at all.
    I have never met an atheist that assert "their morality is founded in the Greek views on philosophy". Not one. Atheism is not a religion. And your article is just that, what makes you think it proves anything?
    Last edited by Pragmatist; 12th August 2017 at 02:25 AM.

  7. #1237
    Senior Member Michael J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kmiller1610 View Post
    The article is about how there is no difference between religion and any world view that provides the "means for realizing the highest values of life. "

    This is why so many atheists assert that their morality is founded in the Greek views on philosophy.

    Believing in the absence of God requires faith because you can't prove it. Whereas agnosticism can't be a religion because simple doubt does not require faith at all.
    Atheists don't believe in the absence of God. Atheism is simply the default assumption if no one can prove God exists.

    Your logical fallacy is called a Chewbacca Defense.

  8. #1238
    Veteran Member aboutenough's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael J View Post
    Answers in Genesis is a Christian Dominionist website.

    They make the same Texas Sharpshooter fallacies where they read the Genesis creation story and shoehorn observations into it.



    Atheists don't believe that matter arose by natural processes. They accept the facts proven by thermodynamics: matter and energy is eternal because it can't be created or destroyed, and can't arise by natural processes.



    Atheists know very well that a body does not cease to exist after it dies. The body's brain ceases to function, but the body remains tangible. The author of that post doesn't even understand the words he or she uses.



    A default assumption is not a belief.

    Since you're not educated, I'll explain something important about logic.

    In logic, there is something called a burden of proof. This is a requirement of evidence that one must present, and it is forced upon the individual making a positive claim. In regards to the existence of a God, the theist is the one positively claiming God exists, and therefore carries the burden of proof. Since methodological naturalism cannot even study the existence of a supernatural God, no theist can present evidence of God's existence. So the theist must have faith (the antithesis of evidence) that a supernatural God exists.

    The individual who makes a negative claim about something does not carry the burden of proof. These are the atheists. So they therefore do not believe a God doesn't exist, they by default reject the theistic claims concerning the existence of a God.



    Atheists definitely do not have that. That is obvious.



    They may have conventions, but they certainly do not institutionalize their beliefs. They have no beliefs regarding gods and the supernatural, so of course they do not have institutionalized practices, beliefs, and attitudes.



    Every organism, human or non-human, religious or not religious, has a conscious.

    Every human being, along with many other species of mammals, religious or not, conforms. One cannot live in a society without conforming to the community's demands. You need to read Joost Meerloo's psychology books.



    Everyone, religious or not, has a cause.



    Answers in Genesis is a pseudo-science website. As I explained above, it reads the Genesis creation story and shoehorns fake observations into it.

    You make the same Texas Sharpshooter fallacies again and again. You grab random sets of data that is often false, take it out of context and use it to test and construct an argument. You used that idiotic article because its author did the same thing.
    The Supreme court finds that atheism has the same rights as a religion from various court cases because its a firmly held belief. When you say the government protects you from religion, you then are stating your beliefs need protection from another belief, making atheism a protected group. KAUFMAN v. McCAUGHTRY | FindLaw

  9. #1239
    Veteran Member aboutenough's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael J View Post
    By that logic, any community of interest is therefore a religion exclusively because they have meetings and form groups. The Robocop fan page on Facebook that I'm a part of is a religion. The Democratic and Republican parties are religions. Even Public Citizen is a religion.



    I played at a piano recital that was held in a church when I was eight years old. That event had nothing at all to do with religion.
    Atheism many times has been designated a religion by federal courts. https://www.scribd.com/document/2452...Humansits-v-US

  10. #1240
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aboutenough View Post
    Atheism many times has been designated a religion by federal courts. https://www.scribd.com/document/2452...Humansits-v-US
    No, it hasn't. It was referenced as "being treated as a religion." That's not the same as "being designated a religion." Atheism isn't a religion any more than "off" is a television channel.
    Last edited by Djinn; 12th August 2017 at 06:20 PM.

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