Results 1 to 8 of 8
Thanks Tree6Thanks
  • 1 Post By The Man
  • 2 Post By Wonderer
  • 1 Post By Singularity
  • 1 Post By HayJenn
  • 1 Post By Singularity

Thread: Russia blocking OPCW from Douma, says UK

  1. #1
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    36,732
    Thanks
    21584

    From
    Toronto

    Russia blocking OPCW from Douma, says UK

    (CNN)The UK has accused Syria and Russia of preventing independent chemical weapons experts from entering the city of Douma, hit by a suspected gas attack that Western leaders have blamed on the Syrian government.

    A fact-finding team from the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) arrived in Syria on Saturday, the same day the US, UK and France carried out airstrikes against Syrian government targets in response to the April 7 attack in Douma.

    But by Monday, the team had still not been granted safe passage, according to the UK envoy to the OPCW, Peter Wilson. The US expressed concerns that Russia may have tampered with evidence at the site.

    The OPCW team is tasked with determining whether banned substances were used in the attack, a charge that both Syria and its most powerful ally, Russia, have vehemently denied.

    Syria's Deputy Foreign Minister Fayssal Mikdad said Monday his country was ready to facilitate the OPCW team in any way to carry out its mission, the state-run SANA news agency reported, while Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov did not respond directly to CNN's question on whether Russia had blocked the experts. Peskov said only that Russia was against "groundless" accusations about who was responsible for the attack.

    Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov said the OPCW team's arrival was hampered by the weekend air strikes, state media RIA Novosti reported.

    The suspected chemical attack is the latest issue to heighten tensions between Russia and Western powers. More than 100 Russian diplomats were expelled from more than 20 countries in March over the poisoning of a Russian ex-spy on British soil, which the UK and US has blamed on the Russian government. Russia denies the accusations.

    Russian officials last week claimed British intelligence agencies had helped stage the suspected chemical attack in Douma.

    "Yet again, Russia is spreading conspiracy theories and misinformation designed to undermine the integrity of the OPCW's fact finding mission," Wilson said in a statement.

    "A significant body of information, including intelligence, indicates the Syrian regime is responsible for this latest attack."

    The US envoy to the OPCW, Kenneth D. Ward, said he was concerned that Russia may have interfered with the site of the Douma attack.

    "We are concerned they may have tampered with it with the intent of thwarting the efforts of the OPCW Fact Finding Mission to conduct an effective investigation. This raises serious questions about the ability of the (team) to do its job," he said in a statement Monday.

    Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said last week his country had sent experts to the site and found "no trace" of chemical weapons use. On Monday, he told the BBC's Hardtalk show that he guaranteed there had been no Russian tampering.

    Around 75 people, including children, were killed in the Douma assault, UK officials have said, while 500 people were treated in the attack's aftermath with symptoms consistent with chemical weapons exposure, the World Health Organization reported, citing its partners on the ground.

    The OPCW has recorded more than 390 allegations of chemical weapons use in Syria since its investigation began in 2014, Wilson said.
    More: Chemical weapons experts blocked from Syrian attack site, UK says

    Also:
    U.K.: Chemical-Arms Inspectors Not Allowed Access To Douma
    Chemical weapons inspection in Syria delayed as Russia, U.S. trade barbs over airstrikes | CBC News
    Kremlin Denies Allegations that Russia Is Blocking Inspectors' Access to Douma
    TASS: Russian Politics & Diplomacy - Russia prepared to provide transport, military police escort to OPCW in Eastern Ghouta

    UN vehicles carrying the OPCW people arrive to hotel in Damascus on April 14th


    Situation in Douma right now:

    Syrian police ride into the town, with a Russian Military Police truck behind them and a Russian officer in desert camo back there


    Some local kids pose for a photo with a Russian soldier

    and take pics of another Russian, guy from North Caucasus, from his appearance, posing on a horse

    lol

    Some men on a motorcycle wave a Syrian, Assad flag


    Looks peaceful and safe enough to me... But, of course, this is from the Assad/Russia point of view.
    Thanks from bajisima

  2. #2
    Flibbertigibbet Wonderer's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2014
    Posts
    23,991
    Thanks
    15774

    From
    Missouri
    Again...shocker.
    Thanks from bajisima and The Man

  3. #3
    Civis americanus borealis Singularity's Avatar
    Joined
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    26,052
    Thanks
    17233

    From
    Kansas
    We're learning that international law on the use of WMD is effectively meaningless.

    WMD is used when the offending party, for whatever reason, doesn't fear retaliation.

    WMD is not used when all potential offending parties fear retaliation.

    The Russians have decided they are prepared to guarantee Basahar al-Assad against any retaliation which puts him at significant risk.

    This should concern us greatly, not because it's a violation of international law, but because it's a *very* short step for them to contemplate WMD usage themselves on the battlefield against their enemies, or us. It's an extraordinarily dangerous escalation.

    In fact, with it being as blatant as it is, I believe the U.S. should assassinate Assad. We then need to make it plain that Russia, unless it's prepared to go to war with us, has no ability to guarantee the safety of any nation which uses WMD, itself included.

    We can't play checkers when Putin is playing chess. Time to start marching our pawn to the other side of the board and dare Putin to do something about it.
    Thanks from The Man

  4. #4
    Moderator HayJenn's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    50,298
    Thanks
    38726

    From
    CA
    Quote Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
    We're learning that international law on the use of WMD is effectively meaningless.

    WMD is used when the offending party, for whatever reason, doesn't fear retaliation.

    WMD is not used when all potential offending parties fear retaliation.

    The Russians have decided they are prepared to guarantee Basahar al-Assad against any retaliation which puts him at significant risk.

    This should concern us greatly, not because it's a violation of international law, but because it's a *very* short step for them to contemplate WMD usage themselves on the battlefield against their enemies, or us. It's an extraordinarily dangerous escalation.

    In fact, with it being as blatant as it is, I believe the U.S. should assassinate Assad. We then need to make it plain that Russia, unless it's prepared to go to war with us, has no ability to guarantee the safety of any nation which uses WMD, itself included.

    We can't play checkers when Putin is playing chess. Time to start marching our pawn to the other side of the board and dare Putin to do something about it.
    Well, this does not help either


    President Trump on Monday put the brakes on a preliminary plan to impose additional economic sanctions on Russia, walking back a Sunday announcement by U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley that the Kremlin had swiftly denounced as “international economic raiding.”

    Preparations to punish Russia anew for its support of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad’s government over the alleged chemical weapons attack in Syria caused consternation at the White House. Haley had said on CBS News’s “Face the Nation” that sanctions on Russian companies behind the equipment related to Assad’s alleged chemical weapons attack would be announced Monday by Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin.

    But Trump conferred with his national security advisers later Sunday and told them he was upset the sanctions were being officially rolled out because he was not yet comfortable executing them, according to several people familiar with the plan.

    Administration officials said the economic sanctions were under serious consideration, along with other measures that could be taken against Russia, but said Trump had not given final authorization to implement them. Administration officials said Monday it was unlikely Trump would approve any additional sanctions without another triggering event by Russia, describing the strategy as being in a holding pattern.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.ecdd92a602b5
    Thanks from The Man

  5. #5
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    36,732
    Thanks
    21584

    From
    Toronto
    Quote Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
    We're learning that international law on the use of WMD is effectively meaningless.

    WMD is used when the offending party, for whatever reason, doesn't fear retaliation.

    WMD is not used when all potential offending parties fear retaliation.

    The Russians have decided they are prepared to guarantee Basahar al-Assad against any retaliation which puts him at significant risk.

    This should concern us greatly, not because it's a violation of international law, but because it's a *very* short step for them to contemplate WMD usage themselves on the battlefield against their enemies, or us. It's an extraordinarily dangerous escalation.

    In fact, with it being as blatant as it is, I believe the U.S. should assassinate Assad. We then need to make it plain that Russia, unless it's prepared to go to war with us, has no ability to guarantee the safety of any nation which uses WMD, itself included.

    We can't play checkers when Putin is playing chess. Time to start marching our pawn to the other side of the board and dare Putin to do something about it.
    The Russians already have used chem weapons before:

    The Moscow theater hostage crisis (also known as the 2002 Nord-Ost siege) was the seizure of a crowded Dubrovka Theater by 40 to 50 armed Chechens on 23 October 2002 that involved 850 hostages and ended with the death of at least 170 people. The attackers, led by Movsar Barayev, claimed allegiance to the Islamist separatist movement in Chechnya.[1] They demanded the withdrawal of Russian forces from Chechnya and an end to the Second Chechen War.

    Due to the layout of the theater, special forces would have had to fight through 30 metres (100 ft) of corridor and attack up a well defended staircase before they could reach the hall in which the hostages were held. The attackers had numerous explosives, with the most powerful in the center of the auditorium. After the murder of two female hostages two-and-a-half days in, Spetsnaz operators from Federal Security Service (FSB) Alpha and Vega Groups, supported by a Russian Ministry of Internal Affairs (MVD) SOBR unit, pumped an undisclosed chemical agent into the building's ventilation system and began the rescue operation.[1]

    All 40 of the terrorists were killed,[2] and up to 204 hostages died during the siege, including nine foreigners, due to poisoning by the gas.[3] All but two of the hostages who died during the siege were killed by the toxic substance pumped into the theater to subdue the terrorists.[4][5] The identity of the gas was never disclosed.[6]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow...hostage_crisis

    I have also read about a large group of Chechen insurgents hiding inside a network of caves way up in the mountains. And how the feds allegedly pumped some sort of gas into the caves which quickly killed everyone in there. That would have been 1999/2000, when the federal forces, under Putin's new leadership, re-invaded Chechnya and were clearing out all the separatists and Islamists...

    So, yeah, it's too late, if that's your goal, to deter Russia from using such WMDs. They already have. And possibly many other times that are not known, in Chechnya, Dagestan, and elsewhere.

  6. #6
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    36,732
    Thanks
    21584

    From
    Toronto
    Anyway, the Russians claim to have found in Douma people who participated in the supposed staging of the chemical attack video:

    THE HAGUE, April 16. /TASS/. Russian specialists who probed into the rumored use of chemical weapons in Syria’s Douma have found some participants in the faked video footage presented as evidence of an alleged chemical attack, Russia’s representative at the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons, Aleksandr Shulgin, said at the 58th meeting of the OPCW Executive Council on Monday.

    "Not a single witness or affected patient in hospital has been found. Nor any traces of chemical ammunition have been identified. Instead, we managed to find those who participated in filming the faked video, which was eventually presented as ‘proof’ of the chemical attack," Shulgin said. "They showed us the scenes in which they took part in the staged video. Both have medical education. They work for Douma’s ambulance service," he added.

    Shulgin described the released video as a provocation and pointed to "pseudo-humanitarian NGOs, including the White Helmets" as its "makers."

    "We said before and we are saying once again that these organizations are on the payroll of the governments of the United States, Britain and some other countries," he said. "They are paid agents, actors, who perform the role of backstage extras when they are asked to. For the Western countries’ money they make various faked videos and spread photographs with the most favored type of scenes - ‘poor children - victims of Assad’s bloody regime’."

    Shulgin showed to the participants in the Executive Council’s meeting pictures of participants in such photo sessions proving well enough "the engaged actors all of a sudden rise from the dead and look alive and healthy."
    "That children are used in such fakes is particularly disgusting," he said.

    A number of NGO’s including the White Helmets have been claiming that chemical weapons were used in Syria’s Douma on April 7. The US, Britain and France dealt a missile strike last weekend against Syria’s military and civilian infrastructures ostensibly in retaliation for the alleged chemical attack by Syrian government forces. Staffers of the Russian center for the reconciliation of conflicting parties in Syria explored Douma on April 9 to find no traces of chemical weapons. Experts from the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons arrived in Damascus on April 14 with the aim to proceed with the investigation.
    TASS: Russian Politics & Diplomacy - Envoy to OPCW says Russia found participants of staged 'chemical attack' video in Syria

  7. #7
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    36,732
    Thanks
    21584

    From
    Toronto

    Wow. They had the resources to build things like this, yet not, apparently, to provide for the population...

  8. #8
    Civis americanus borealis Singularity's Avatar
    Joined
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    26,052
    Thanks
    17233

    From
    Kansas
    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    The Russians already have used chem weapons before:



    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow...hostage_crisis

    I have also read about a large group of Chechen insurgents hiding inside a network of caves way up in the mountains. And how the feds allegedly pumped some sort of gas into the caves which quickly killed everyone in there. That would have been 1999/2000, when the federal forces, under Putin's new leadership, re-invaded Chechnya and were clearing out all the separatists and Islamists...

    So, yeah, it's too late, if that's your goal, to deter Russia from using such WMDs. They already have. And possibly many other times that are not known, in Chechnya, Dagestan, and elsewhere.
    We can't do anything about world powers gassing people within their own borders. If Russia wants to act as if Syria is 100 percent an integrated vassal and that attempting to destroy Assad for using WMD is equivalent to attempting to destroy the Putin regime, then we can't do anything about that either.

    But if that's not the case, if Russia is bluffing and will not stand by Assad when he really steps in it, then we need to call their bluff. When the U.S. intervened against Iraq in 1991, Saddam threatened to deploy WMD in the warzone and on Israel. We threatened nuclear retaliation in no uncertain terms. He backed off.

    When things are this fucked up, that's the kind of spine we need.
    Thanks from The Man

Similar Threads

  1. Navy admits blocking WND
    By Robodoon in forum Current Events
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 6th March 2007, 08:35 AM
  2. Navy admits blocking WND
    By Robodoon in forum Current Events
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 6th March 2007, 08:23 AM
  3. BLOCKING JUSTICE
    By Inkslinger in forum Political Discussion
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 15th May 2006, 03:18 PM

Tags for this Thread


Facebook Twitter RSS Feed