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Thread: Germany "totally controlled", "captive" by Russia: Trump

  1. #11
    Going Nuclear- Daily Yetisports6 - Big Wave Champion, Bezerk Champion, All Ball Champion, Magic Gem Champion, Crystal Clear Champion, Flower Power Champion, Space Thieves TD Champion, X-treme Moto Idiot Cross Champion, Micro Tanks Champion, Race Horse Tycoon Champion, Railway Line Champion, Raju Meter 2 Champion, Metal Slug - Kill the Nazis Champion, Decoder Champion, 1 in 24 Speed v32  Champion Crusher's Avatar
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    It's time to pull out of Germany completely. We helped them recover from WWII and they can stand and survive on their own. That goes for many of the NATO nations. If others want to strike independent agreement with the U.S. for defense, that is fine. But, those deals need to be win/win deals, not what we have going on right now.

    We can spend more on retiring our debt and our citizens if we are not paying for European Defense.

  2. #12
    Senior Member NeoVsMatrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crusher View Post
    It's time to pull out of Germany completely. We helped them recover from WWII and they can stand and survive on their own. That goes for many of the NATO nations. If others want to strike independent agreement with the U.S. for defense, that is fine. But, those deals need to be win/win deals, not what we have going on right now.

    We can spend more on retiring our debt and our citizens if we are not paying for European Defense.
    oh please.. start thinking about what your posting. The US will not in any long shot pull out of NATO... they NEED the NATO countries to buy US weapons. Why else do you think Trump wants them to spend more money ?

    The only time NATO actually DID come to help one of their partners, was when the US called upon them after 9/11. aside from that, they're a practicing unit, for the worst case, and a huge money maker for the US weapons industry.

    And you think Germany would have any issues if the US would pull their remaining 30k troops out ? i haven't checked lately, but those troops are costing Germany an arm and a leg every year.
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  3. #13
    Veteran Member Dangermouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crusher View Post
    It's time to pull out of Germany completely. We helped them recover from WWII and they can stand and survive on their own. That goes for many of the NATO nations. If others want to strike independent agreement with the U.S. for defense, that is fine. But, those deals need to be win/win deals, not what we have going on right now.

    We can spend more on retiring our debt and our citizens if we are not paying for European Defense.
    It's all fake. The US historically spends insane amounts on defence, and whines when others don't. There is no separate NATO budget, just a commitment for members to put 2% of their spending toward NATO. In materiel or manpower or facilities. Since America spends more on defence than the next ten countries do, then 2% of that is a lot more.
    The other aspect to consider is who was NATO set up to defend against, and who would like Trump not to do that anymore? If Trump breaks the western alliance, who benefits? It won't be Joe Schmo in the flyover states getting a tax refund.
    Last edited by Dangermouse; 11th July 2018 at 01:40 PM.
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  4. #14
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crusher View Post
    It's time to pull out of Germany completely. We helped them recover from WWII and they can stand and survive on their own. That goes for many of the NATO nations. If others want to strike independent agreement with the U.S. for defense, that is fine. But, those deals need to be win/win deals, not what we have going on right now.

    We can spend more on retiring our debt and our citizens if we are not paying for European Defense.
    Retiring our debt.... HAH! What a laugh! Trump is EXPLODING our debt! What an illusionary world you must live in!

  5. #15
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the man View Post
    more: trump blasts us ally germany as 'captive to russia' in tense opening of nato summit

    i'm not sure if he was trying to insult merkel, flatter putin before their summit, or both...
    A: Both.
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  6. #16
    Moderator jacobfitcher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    More: Trump blasts US ally Germany as 'captive to Russia' in tense opening of NATO summit

    I'm not sure if he was trying to insult Merkel, flatter Putin before their summit, or both...
    He was trying to look "tough".
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  7. #17
    The Un-Holy One The Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dangermouse View Post
    It's all fake. The US historically spends insane amounts on defence, and whines when others don't. There is no separate NATO budget, just a commitment for members to put 2% of their spemning toward NATO. Since America spemds more than the next ten countries do, then 2% of that is a lot more. The other aspect to consider is who was NATO set up to defend against, and who would like Trump not to do that anymore? If he breal]ks the western alliance, who benefits. It won't be Joe Schmo in the flyover states getting a tax refund.
    It's true. If you're Estonia with 1.2 million people, 25% of those - ethnic Russians, whose loyalty in a conflict with Russia (150 million people) you cannot be sure of... You're gonna WANT an alliance like NATO there, just in case...
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  8. #18
    Moderator jacobfitcher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DebateDrone View Post
    Trump caused even more damage. Trump's Iran deal played right into Putin's hands. That is what makes his anger at Germany so laughable.

    Trump's real reason in wanting the +7 to pull out of the Iran deal was to hurt the Iranian economy. He was hoping to hurt Iran's oil revenues and put domestic pressure on the Ayatollahs. It backfired on Trump when the EU did not go along with Trump's sanctions. When the EU did not go along with not purchasing Iranian oil. And backfired even more as tariffs on China caused China to stop purchasing US domestic oil. 40% of US oil exports was to China.

    Saudi and Russia slipped in to fill the oil from the US. Earning Russia hard currency that helps them to fight off what little sanctions place on Russia by Congess.

    Russia is building two huge Natgas pipelines to gernany which will help Germany transition fro Nuclear...off coal onto natgas


    This hurts Trump coal buddies bigly. Coal exports suffer...and Remember when China was buying all that specialized US Coal with coke in that is used in the manufacture of steel.

    Oh shit steel Trump is placing tariffs on.

    Trump is a mess. If Trump isn't fucking something up..he eating KFC or playing golf.
    He is the CEO of the USA, and like many of his other companies, he's going to bankrupt it.

  9. #19
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLeRoy View Post
    A: Both.
    And, in 1976, there was a debate between Gerald Ford and Jimmy Carter during the Presidential campaign, during which Gerald Ford committed a truly colossal faux pas, widely considered to be the WORST blunder ever made during a Presidential debate. Carter didn't pounce on it during the debate, but it triggered a HUGE CONTROVERSY immediately afterwards. Ford had said that Poland was NOT a 'captive nation', even though it was very much behind the Iron Curtain and very much under the control of the Soviet Union.

    There are a LARGE number of Poles living in the Chicago and Milwaukee areas, in particular. They were FURIOUS.

    What Trump just said was WORSE.
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  10. #20
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    It's true. If you're Estonia with 1.2 million people, 25% of those - ethnic Russians, whose loyalty in a conflict with Russia (150 million people) you cannot be sure of... You're gonna WANT an alliance like NATO there, just in case...
    Yeah, dude! I've been telling you that!!
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