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Thread: A suggestion to curtail illegal immigration

  1. #11
    It's a trap AttusBlack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kallie Knoetze View Post
    Mr. RNG,

    With regard to your first point, I'm glad you agree with me that finally President Trump is doing something about illegal immigration. Unfortunately, you seem to misunderstand what e-verify is. It is a largely volunteer program which only applies to federal contracts. Some states require e-verify for state contacts, but other states like California have severely limited the use of e-verify, whereas other states, like NY do not require it to be used. And there are no teeth in the sanctions part other than the denial of a government contract.

    With regard to your second point, a "prime contractor" law would not and cannot work for subcontractors. Basically, you can't hold someone responsible for someone else's malfeasance. You can require a prime contractor to require that their subs hire only legal workers, but if they don't, you can't penalized the prime for the actions of the subcontractors, unless they were complacent in the actions.

    I know, I know, you say that works for safety and environmental guidelines, but you are talking apples and oranges. The owner of a project is legal obligation to follow environmental law. If environmental damage occurs, they will have to deal with it. They can go back an sue the sub for causing the damage, but the owner is the one who pays the fines. Similarly, the owner is responsible for providing a safe working environment within the bounds of the project. Meaning, everybody who comes into a project area must comply with the owner's code of safe practices.

    On a third point, companies don't pick the low bid because they are greedy, but rather, because they have prudent business models. Point of fact, a smart company owner would likely not take a low bid with that much disparity without looking into why. Another point of fact, government agencies are required to take the low bid. Are you saying government is greedy?

    And finally, no need to apologize....Italians are pretty sketchy characters....
    I congratulate you on spelling it out pretty precisely. Thank You again.

  2. #12
    Veteran Member MaryAnne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kallie Knoetze View Post
    Mr. RNG,

    With regard to your first point, I'm glad you agree with me that finally President Trump is doing something about illegal immigration. Unfortunately, you seem to misunderstand what e-verify is. It is a largely volunteer program which only applies to federal contracts. Some states require e-verify for state contacts, but other states like California have severely limited the use of e-verify, whereas other states, like NY do not require it to be used. And there are no teeth in the sanctions part other than the denial of a government contract.

    With regard to your second point, a "prime contractor" law would not and cannot work for subcontractors. Basically, you can't hold someone responsible for someone else's malfeasance. You can require a prime contractor to require that their subs hire only legal workers, but if they don't, you can't penalized the prime for the actions of the subcontractors, unless they were complacent in the actions.

    I know, I know, you say that works for safety and environmental guidelines, but you are talking apples and oranges. The owner of a project is legal obligation to follow environmental law. If environmental damage occurs, they will have to deal with it. They can go back an sue the sub for causing the damage, but the owner is the one who pays the fines. Similarly, the owner is responsible for providing a safe working environment within the bounds of the project. Meaning, everybody who comes into a project area must comply with the owner's code of safe practices.

    On a third point, companies don't pick the low bid because they are greedy, but rather, because they have prudent business models. Point of fact, a smart company owner would likely not take a low bid with that much disparity without looking into why. Another point of fact, government agencies are required to take the low bid. Are you saying government is greedy?

    And finally, no need to apologize....Italians are pretty sketchy characters....
    Mr. Knoetze,

    I have to give you credit for this post.

    But I do not understand why they can not be verified.

    And you are quite right on the greedy Vs. prudent companies who investigate the disparities in bids.

  3. #13
    Veteran Member MaryAnne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AttusBlack View Post
    I congratulate you on spelling it out pretty precisely. Thank You again.
    Yes,that was a very well thought out post.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kallie Knoetze View Post
    Mr. RNG,

    With regard to your first point, I'm glad you agree with me that finally President Trump is doing something about illegal immigration. Unfortunately, you seem to misunderstand what e-verify is. It is a largely volunteer program which only applies to federal contracts. Some states require e-verify for state contacts, but other states like California have severely limited the use of e-verify, whereas other states, like NY do not require it to be used. And there are no teeth in the sanctions part other than the denial of a government contract.

    With regard to your second point, a "prime contractor" law would not and cannot work for subcontractors. Basically, you can't hold someone responsible for someone else's malfeasance. You can require a prime contractor to require that their subs hire only legal workers, but if they don't, you can't penalized the prime for the actions of the subcontractors, unless they were complacent in the actions.

    I know, I know, you say that works for safety and environmental guidelines, but you are talking apples and oranges. The owner of a project is legal obligation to follow environmental law. If environmental damage occurs, they will have to deal with it. They can go back an sue the sub for causing the damage, but the owner is the one who pays the fines. Similarly, the owner is responsible for providing a safe working environment within the bounds of the project. Meaning, everybody who comes into a project area must comply with the owner's code of safe practices.

    On a third point, companies don't pick the low bid because they are greedy, but rather, because they have prudent business models. Point of fact, a smart company owner would likely not take a low bid with that much disparity without looking into why. Another point of fact, government agencies are required to take the low bid. Are you saying government is greedy?

    And finally, no need to apologize....Italians are pretty sketchy characters....
    Making eVerify mandatory for all public and private hiring would be a good start.

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