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Thread: The old solutions to economics....won't work anymore-

  1. #21
    Veteran Member GordonGecko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Sampson Simpson View Post
    Did it ever work? No, all it did was make the rich richer, increase tax burden on everybody else, and allowed the rich to control politicians to continue to make them richer
    Odd thing is....it's a recipe for DISASTER for the wealthy.....from the French Revolution to the Russian Revolution.

    As a country becomes more plutocratic...it becomes more oppressive....80-90% of the population becomes poor or near-poor......revolution becomes inevitable. And that usually ends "badly" for the Plutocrats (and their supporters).

    It's why men from wealthy families like Teddy Roosevelt and FDR CLEARLY saw the need for economic reform.

    But today's Rightwing Rich (or their working class and middle class dupes) have completely forgotten the application of the lessons of history.
    Thanks from labrea and OldGaffer

  2. #22
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babba View Post
    It's one way big business has worked to keep wages down.
    Its also how they divide us. One of my sons friends has been interviewing in Boston for his "dream job" with a massive biotech firm. He has wanted to work there forever. The last month or so he spent interviewing and they finally made him an offer. Well it was super low and insulting as he is a biochemical engineer. I mean fast food wages. He tried to renegotiate the salary but it was pretty much, "take it or leave it." It made him really angry and it caused him to be pissed at friends of his that didn't go to college and made that much. Caused a big divide. He found a social media site online that had a bunch of other college grads with the same offer so they got together and have petitioned Sen Elizabeth Warren to end the H1B visa abuse these companies are using. Hopefully that will end. Its clear abuse.
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  3. #23
    Cat-tastic Babba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    Its also how they divide us. One of my sons friends has been interviewing in Boston for his "dream job" with a massive biotech firm. He has wanted to work there forever. The last month or so he spent interviewing and they finally made him an offer. Well it was super low and insulting as he is a biochemical engineer. I mean fast food wages. He tried to renegotiate the salary but it was pretty much, "take it or leave it." It made him really angry and it caused him to be pissed at friends of his that didn't go to college and made that much. Caused a big divide. He found a social media site online that had a bunch of other college grads with the same offer so they got together and have petitioned Sen Elizabeth Warren to end the H1B visa abuse these companies are using. Hopefully that will end. Its clear abuse.
    That is infuriating. That's why I get pissed when people suggest the only solution is for everyone to have college degrees. (The Clintons have always promoted that idea and it irritates the shit out of me. Besides the fact that shit like what you describe happens, we still need roofers and backhoe drivers and trash collectors and carpenters and hotel maids, etc. Although, a college education gives a person a broader perspective on the world, which is always good.) But that's NOT the only solution. We need to value work in general and we don't. We value wealth well above work, as evidenced by the current occupant of the WH. As long as we're going to devalue service workers and now even engineers, it seems a citizen income can be part of the solution. That way, people can pursue their dream jobs and the jobs their degrees qualify for them and earn enough to live off of. Otherwise, we're in a race to the bottom as far as wages.
    Thanks from bajisima and StanStill

  4. #24
    Veteran Member TNVolunteer73's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libertine View Post
    If the population is growing and the number of jobs is declining, there is an obvious solution.
    War? Famine? Pandemic?

  5. #25
    Cat-tastic Babba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TNVolunteer73 View Post
    War? Famine? Pandemic?
    Global warming may well cull the herd.

  6. #26
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babba View Post
    That is infuriating. That's why I get pissed when people suggest the only solution is for everyone to have college degrees. (The Clintons have always promoted that idea and it irritates the shit out of me. Besides the fact that shit like what you describe happens, we still need roofers and backhoe drivers and trash collectors and carpenters and hotel maids, etc. Although, a college education gives a person a broader perspective on the world, which is always good.) But that's NOT the only solution. We need to value work in general and we don't. We value wealth well above work, as evidenced by the current occupant of the WH. As long as we're going to devalue service workers and now even engineers, it seems a citizen income can be part of the solution. That way, people can pursue their dream jobs and the jobs their degrees qualify for them and earn enough to live off of. Otherwise, we're in a race to the bottom as far as wages.
    We have heard about a race to the bottom in wages for non college graduates for a long time since outsourcing became commonplace. But now lowballing college graduates just to bring in workers who can and will take less? That's a whole new level of greed. I heard Robert Reich the other day on the news calling it "insourcing." Where companies refuse to pay so they claim there is no one qualified and then bring in workers from other countries who either are just thrilled to come to the US or ones that have no debt since their home countries pay for it. Its basically using them as well. The worst part of it is that we have billions of dollar of college debt and who will end up bailing them out someday? US taxpayers not these corporations.
    Thanks from Babba

  7. #27
    Cat-tastic Babba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    We have heard about a race to the bottom in wages for non college graduates for a long time since outsourcing became commonplace. But now lowballing college graduates just to bring in workers who can and will take less? That's a whole new level of greed. I heard Robert Reich the other day on the news calling it "insourcing." Where companies refuse to pay so they claim there is no one qualified and then bring in workers from other countries who either are just thrilled to come to the US or ones that have no debt since their home countries pay for it. Its basically using them as well. The worst part of it is that we have billions of dollar of college debt and who will end up bailing them out someday? US taxpayers not these corporations.
    Especially since Trump is determined to lower corporate taxes. And I wouldn't have a problem with that as long as we cut out the loopholes that corporations take advantage of, as Obama suggested. While the current tax rate is 35%, almost no corporations pay that rate and the few that do are too small to take advantage of the loopholes. The effective tax rate is much lower than 35%.



    U.S. Companies Lobbying Furiously To Save Corporate Tax Loopholes: Study | The Huffington Post
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  8. #28
    Veteran Member GordonGecko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babba View Post
    Global warming may well cull the herd.
    Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter are sterile....so maybe Nature's fixing the problem that way?


  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    Its also how they divide us. One of my sons friends has been interviewing in Boston for his "dream job" with a massive biotech firm. He has wanted to work there forever. The last month or so he spent interviewing and they finally made him an offer. Well it was super low and insulting as he is a biochemical engineer. I mean fast food wages. He tried to renegotiate the salary but it was pretty much, "take it or leave it." It made him really angry and it caused him to be pissed at friends of his that didn't go to college and made that much. Caused a big divide. He found a social media site online that had a bunch of other college grads with the same offer so they got together and have petitioned Sen Elizabeth Warren to end the H1B visa abuse these companies are using. Hopefully that will end. Its clear abuse.
    Did you advise him to take it anyway?

    If he loves the job, mostly likely the money and everything else will take care of itself.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
    What's that? And be as specific as possible.
    There is only one side of the equation that we have much control over.

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