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Thread: Best high schools for 2018: most are charter schools

  1. #41
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    Thatís the key difference. Charter schools can cherry-pick their students, avoiding students that will require more school resources. Public schools take everyone; without exception. And if a student is severely disabled and requires a dedicated instructor, the public school is obligated to provide it.

    Itís no surprise that charter schools do better; they get to pick the students they want, and leave the others behind.
    All very true but its also somewhat true for public schools. The very best ones around here are in areas so expensive not everyone can live there. So in that way, public schools also cherry pick. It may not be done intentionally but the same metric still holds, if you are poor you dont end up there unless you get lucky.

  2. #42
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paris View Post
    But how long is the rest of the day? In France you're lucky if your high school day ends at 4 pm, as it's usually 5 and sometimes 6. When in the US, school always ended at 3 PM, then off to whatever hobby you had. For me it was couch tending.
    Depends. Here most of the charters are full day, 8-5. Our local public schools begin at 7 am and are done at 2 pm.

  3. #43
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasselas View Post
    Interesting. Federal law requires school districts to offer students the "least restrictive environment," which basically means the most "normal" school experience they can handle. A charter that caters to such students sounds like a means by which public schools shunt problem kids away from typical classrooms. As with mental institutions, I suspect an environment made up entirely of kids with emotional/behavior problems will tend to lead to worse behavioral problems for all of them. I wonder if the districts involved have really made a good faith effort to make modifications that would allow some of those kids to be in a less restrictive environment.

    How does such a school organized? Students with IEPs sometimes bring in more money to the district, but they are also more expensive to serve. How does such a charter get paid? (The whole thing makes me think of private prisons and the issues associated with them).
    As far as I know charters get the same money from the district and are equal to public schools. Essentially they are public schools. But some do have troubled or special needs schools only. Parents, school boards and teachers decide its best. Its why I do think New England schools tend to do better on tests, they dont mainstream all that much. Even in our public schools, they have wings that are locked off from the rest of the school for these special kids. Totally different teachers, cafeterias, recess etc. Not really mainstreamed at all. The unions dont want them mainstreamed as they interfere with tests and honor programs. I was told when my family moved to New England that basically "you keep up or get left behind" in all the schools. When we lived in NY it wasnt that way at all. Special needs kids were mainstreamed.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    All very true but its also somewhat true for public schools. The very best ones around here are in areas so expensive not everyone can live there. So in that way, public schools also cherry pick. It may not be done intentionally but the same metric still holds, if you are poor you dont end up there unless you get lucky.
    That doesn't make sense. Schools don't do any picking--parents do when they decide where to live. The fact is that you're almost guaranteed to send your kids to a decent school if you live in "above the median housing." Doesn't matter if you are renting or own, if you live in a dwelling whose value is above the median value for your area, the school you send your kid to will be a decent school. If you live in below the median housing, you run risks.

    There's a pretty simple way to solve this problem--equalize funding between schools. Most school funding comes from states, but the key funding difference comes from local property taxes. If states pooled property taxes and then redistributed the money equally among districts on a per pupil basis, much of that difference would disappear. Schools could still tap parent groups and local non-profits that could solicit local funds voluntarily, but it wouldn't be hard to decouple local property values from school funding. Of course, the poorer one is and the younger one is, the less likely one is to vote, so that's not going to happen.

    We often hear American public education derided, and we don't compare particularly well to schools in other countries, but the differences are accounted for almost entirely in the lower achievement of our economically poorest students. Our well-to-do achieve at comparable levels to the well-heeled in other nations. Our poorer students do significantly less well than poorer students in Korea or Japan or Finland. I wonder why that is...wait...no I don't.
    Last edited by Rasselas; 10th May 2018 at 06:19 AM.

  5. #45
    Member Claudius the God's Avatar
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    All that list does is show that if you pick out the best students from any public school in a high income area and let them join a charter school, that school will end up being scored higher due to the cherry picking.
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  6. #46
    Veteran Member MaryAnne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasselas View Post
    I'm wondering how many of those schools get to choose their students.
    All of them. I do not believe that survey.

    Kasichís Charter Schools had a scandal a week. My Grandson graduated last year from one of the best Public Schools. Much of the class already have 2 year College Degrees.

  7. #47
    Veteran Member MaryAnne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    All very true but its also somewhat true for public schools. The very best ones around here are in areas so expensive not everyone can live there. So in that way, public schools also cherry pick. It may not be done intentionally but the same metric still holds, if you are poor you dont end up there unless you get lucky.
    Every School District I know in my area has wealthy, middle class and poor students.

    Except in the cities where those who could afford it left when Congress decided in their wisdom to force students to be bussed across town, instead of the neighborhood Schools close by.

    Those who could afford it moved out. White, Black,Asian. We all now live in the Suburbs where not one worries what you are.

    City Schools have been in shambles for 2 Generations now because there is no one left to pay taxes,support the Schools.

    And Charter Schools drain money from public Education.
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  8. #48
    Veteran Member MaryAnne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    Charter schools are normally considered public schools so they have no tuition. But most do have a lottery process to get in.
    Of course they have no tuition. They take money from Public Education. That is tax payer money and it hurts the funding of Public Schools.

    Kasich cut Public funding so bad his Republican Legislature put it back in the budget. They also cracked down on his wealthy friends Charter Schools after numerous scandals.

  9. #49
    Veteran Member MaryAnne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    I have a 4-year old who can't start kindergarten until September 2019, and he can already read at a 2nd-3rd grade level, knows how to text and type and can have conversations that way, knew his alphabet by age 2, basically just seems gifted. We're moving to a new place in a "good" school zone in significant part due to wanting him to have better opportunities than where we've been living. We could afford to buy our way into a good school zone. We're not clamoring for him to go to the very best school in the country, just something that offers enough to keep him challenged and actively learning rather than waiting for his slower classmates to catch up to him.

    I want my kids to have "the best" that they can have relative to their personalities and needs and abilities. I'm not convinced that whatever school ranks the absolute best is necessarily "best" for my kids. I want them to have abundant opportunities, enjoy their childhoods, and friends who excel and are well-rounded. There are a lot of "good" schools that don't show up on any of these rankings that I think could offer that to them. I find the parental fixation on super-high pressure to be the absolute-best and hyper-competitive and involved in absolutely everything to be very unappealing.
    The question so many get is,Ē Are they emotionally ready!Ē Now. So many are advanced, but that emotional is always there.

    Is he in Pre-School? Even Day Care is great for single children. Teaches them how to get along with others.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MaryAnne View Post
    The question so many get is,” Are they emotionally ready!” Now. So many are advanced, but that emotional is always there.

    Is he in Pre-School? Even Day Care is great for single children. Teaches them how to get along with others.
    Where we'd been living previously, the only pre-school was for low-income families, so we didn't qualify and thus had no pre-school options. Where we're moving, we'll be enrolling him in preschool at our cost. He has a 2-year old brother and can get along with kids fine. But I agree, for some kids the academic learning is easiest and the social/emotional development/learning can be more challenging.

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