Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 16
Thanks Tree8Thanks

Thread: SCOTUS Justices & The Red Mass

  1. #1
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    56,280
    Thanks
    32302

    From
    Cleveland, Ohio

    SCOTUS Justices & The Red Mass

    Every year, at the opening of another SCOTUS season, the Justices and various D.C. luminaries attend a special Catholic worship service known as the Red Mass, where they are blessed by the priest and prayers are offered for God's help to guide them to make wise decisions.

    It's just a custom, and doubtless, some ceremonial customs have value.

    Except....why are men and women who have the ultimate power to uphold the constitution indulging in this behavior?

    It's not plainly offensive to the first amendment, as there are decisions on the constitutionality of prayer in legislative aessions, etc. And arguably, they aren't "at work", so they can freely exercise their religions, if they have one.

    Nonetheless, it seem like shitty behavior to me, especially considering all the ways the Catholic church has been a bad American religious "citizen".

    Your thoughts?

  2. #2
    Veteran Member
    Joined
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    12,827
    Thanks
    3130

    From
    California
    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Every year, at the opening of another SCOTUS season, the Justices and various D.C. luminaries attend a special Catholic worship service known as the Red Mass, where they are blessed by the priest and prayers are offered for God's help to guide them to make wise decisions.

    It's just a custom, and doubtless, some ceremonial customs have value.

    Except....why are men and women who have the ultimate power to uphold the constitution indulging in this behavior?

    It's not plainly offensive to the first amendment, as there are decisions on the constitutionality of prayer in legislative aessions, etc. And arguably, they aren't "at work", so they can freely exercise their religions, if they have one.

    Nonetheless, it seem like shitty behavior to me, especially considering all the ways the Catholic church has been a bad American religious "citizen".

    Your thoughts?
    Ms. Madeline,

    You are whining too much about nothing.
    Thanks from Spookycolt

  3. #3
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    45,459
    Thanks
    27537

    From
    New Hampshire
    Its things like this and the prayer before Congress each day and just knowing we have a Chaplain for Congress does make one think that we are a Christian country. I know people dont think so or dont like to admit it, but these ceremonial acts do lend to its credibility. If the founding fathers had intended a truly secular state they wouldnt have allowed for these things.

    https://chaplain.house.gov/archive/
    Thanks from Madeline

  4. #4
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    56,280
    Thanks
    32302

    From
    Cleveland, Ohio
    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    Its things like this and the prayer before Congress each day and just knowing we have a Chaplain for Congress does make one think that we are a Christian country. I know people dont think so or dont like to admit it, but these ceremonial acts do lend to its credibility. If the founding fathers had intended a truly secular state they wouldnt have allowed for these things.

    https://chaplain.house.gov/archive/
    I wish they'd stop. At the very least, it's a source of prestige for the Catholic church that they absolutely, positively do not deserve, on any metric.
    Thanks from bajisima

  5. #5
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    45,459
    Thanks
    27537

    From
    New Hampshire
    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    I wish they'd stop. At the very least, it's a source of prestige for the Catholic church that they absolutely, positively do not deserve, on any metric.
    Problem is that certain states, Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin etc are heavily Catholic and its so steeped in tradition there. When I first moved to New England, Ray Flynn was mayor of Boston and the local news stations broadcast the morning blessing from the bishop every day from City Hall.
    Thanks from Madeline

  6. #6
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    56,280
    Thanks
    32302

    From
    Cleveland, Ohio
    The Catholic church coveted and acquired more political power than any other religion, and used it corruptly.

  7. #7
    Galactic Ruler Spookycolt's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2012
    Posts
    61,666
    Thanks
    11225

    From
    By the wall
    Its harmless.

    Nothing wrong with getting blessed for anything in my opinion.

    It certainly hasn't ever impacted the Courts decision making so why worry about it now?

  8. #8
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    56,280
    Thanks
    32302

    From
    Cleveland, Ohio
    Quote Originally Posted by Spookycolt View Post
    Its harmless.

    Nothing wrong with getting blessed for anything in my opinion.

    It certainly hasn't ever impacted the Courts decision making so why worry about it now?
    The "harm" lies in appearing to ally with a religious organization, in contravention of the spirit of the 1st amendment.

  9. #9
    Galactic Ruler Spookycolt's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2012
    Posts
    61,666
    Thanks
    11225

    From
    By the wall
    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    The "harm" lies in appearing to ally with a religious organization, in contravention of the spirit of the 1st amendment.
    Like you said, they aren't at work so why do you get to dictate what they do in their off-time?

  10. #10
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    62,618
    Thanks
    31319

    From
    Vulcan
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Mass

    "A Red Mass is a Mass celebrated annually in the Catholic Church for judges, lawyers, law school professors, law students, and government officials. The Mass requests guidance from the Holy Spirit for all who seek justice, and offers the opportunity to reflect on what Catholics believe is the G*d-given power and responsibility of all in the legal profession."

    Note, however, that the Mass is held by the Catholic Church, not the government, and no one's attendance is compelled. There is no constitutional violation here. It is entirely different from using sectarian prayers in governmental functions, since this is not a governmental function.
    Thanks from Madeline and PACE

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 68
    Last Post: 2nd March 2016, 03:39 AM
  2. How Many Justices Will Approve SSM?
    By Madeline in forum Opinion Polls
    Replies: 173
    Last Post: 29th June 2015, 05:40 AM
  3. Replies: 16
    Last Post: 9th December 2014, 10:58 AM
  4. Justices Agree on Right to Own Guns
    By michaelr in forum Political Discussion
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: 20th March 2008, 05:49 AM
  5. Justices say Bush went too far at Guantanamo
    By bluesman in forum Political Discussion
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 29th June 2007, 11:06 PM

Tags for this Thread


Facebook Twitter RSS Feed