View Poll Results: NSA leaker: Heroine or villan?

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  • Heroine

    5 45.45%
  • Villain

    5 45.45%
  • I'll answer in a post

    1 9.09%
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Thread: NSA leaker: Heroine or villan?

  1. #21
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldGaffer View Post
    And vice versa.
    Which is why leakers have to be villains. Both sides protect their own tribe.

  2. #22
    Veteran Member Southern Dad's Avatar
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    She needs to feel afraid. Very afraid. She is going to prison for a long time.

    Reality Winner: Accused leaker is scared after arrest, mom says - CNNPolitics.com

  3. #23
    Veteran Member Micro Machines Champion, Race Against Time Champion Tedminator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    I say hero like Daniel Ellsberg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Ellsberg was against Nixon.

    Contractor charged with leaking classified NSA info on Russian hacking
    By Evan Perez, Jim Sciutto and Laura Jarrett, CNN

    (CNN)The Justice Department announced charges Monday against a federal contractor with Top Secret security clearance, after she allegedly leaked classified information to an online media outlet.
    Reality Leigh Winner, 25, a contractor with Pluribus International Corporation in Georgia, is accused of"removing classified material from a government facility and mailing it to a news outlet," according to a federal complaint.
    http://www.cnn.com/2017/06/05/politics/federal-contractor-leak-prosecution/index.html
    Lol wtf.. her name is Reality Winner?

    Nouns don't make for very good names

  4. #24
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
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    Not sure whether it mitigates anything, but unlike Manning and Snowden, this leak was very limited.

    Snowden released between 50,000 and 200,000 classified documents. Manning released about 700,000 classified documents. It's not realistic to think that either of them read the documents before releasing them; it was an indiscriminate release.

    By contrast, Reality Winner appears to have stolen one document. Possibly a few; articles are unclear on that detail. But given that she printed the information on paper, folded it, secreted it away in her clothes, and walked out with it, it's not likely we're looking at more than a dozen pages, and possibly much less.

    Therefore, it's more likely that she had read every word that she released, and the theft was highly specific and targeted.

  5. #25
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tedminator View Post
    Lol wtf.. her name is Reality Winner?

    Nouns don't make for very good names
    As I mentioned in another thread, problems with Reality are not new to the Trump administration.

  6. #26
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    Not sure whether it mitigates anything, but unlike Manning and Snowden, this leak was very limited.

    Snowden released between 50,000 and 200,000 classified documents. Manning released about 700,000 classified documents. It's not realistic to think that either of them read the documents before releasing them; it was an indiscriminate release.

    By contrast, Reality Winner appears to have stolen one document. Possibly a few; articles are unclear on that detail. But given that she printed the information on paper, folded it, secreted it away in her clothes, and walked out with it, it's not likely we're looking at more than a dozen pages, and possibly much less.

    Therefore, it's more likely that she had read every word that she released, and the theft was highly specific and targeted.
    True but how does one judge that in a criminal aspect? "He only stole a little bit," or "he only lightly assaulted her?" While the degrees of punishment can vary the punishment must still exist.

  7. #27
    Anarquistador StanStill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    Which is why leakers have to be villains. Both sides protect their own tribe.
    What about when the president (or his staff) leaks selective information to retaliate against critics (Valerie Plame) or help their public image (Panetta revealed details about the Bin Laden raid both to the press, and to the writer of Zero Dark Thirty) or just to whine about things (Trump complained that the US pays rent for a military base in Saudi Arabia, which had previously been classified).

    Or does the president get to decide when it is a good leak and when it is a bad leak?

  8. #28
    Begin with a happy Ending Engine-Ear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StanStill View Post
    What about when the president (or his staff) leaks selective information to retaliate against critics (Valerie Plame) or help their public image (Panetta revealed details about the Bin Laden raid both to the press, and to the writer of Zero Dark Thirty) or just to whine about things (Trump complained that the US pays rent for a military base in Saudi Arabia, which had previously been classified).

    Or does the president get to decide when it is a good leak and when it is a bad leak?
    The president can declassify information, Reality can't.

  9. #29
    Veteran Member bajisima's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StanStill View Post
    What about when the president (or his staff) leaks selective information to retaliate against critics (Valerie Plame) or help their public image (Panetta revealed details about the Bin Laden raid both to the press, and to the writer of Zero Dark Thirty) or just to whine about things (Trump complained that the US pays rent for a military base in Saudi Arabia, which had previously been classified).

    Or does the president get to decide when it is a good leak and when it is a bad leak?
    Its an extremely complicated issue for sure. But there still needs to be some action if that info was classified. Otherwise what happens if we get a president who decides to put the nuclear codes out there or a defense secretary decides to put on social media where a secret military mission is headed? If we just overlook the little things, they become much bigger things for somebody else under the guise of "he did it too."

  10. #30
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    True but how does one judge that in a criminal aspect? "He only stole a little bit," or "he only lightly assaulted her?" While the degrees of punishment can vary the punishment must still exist.
    Honestly, I'm not sure. I'm not a legal expert in such matters. But I know that the penalties for stealing a shirt from a department store are different from the penalties for stealing a crate of shirts from a store's warehouse.

    If you're just asking me if Reality Winner committed a crime, I'd have to say "yes." If you're asking whether I believe it was justified, I'd probably say "yes" to that as well - but she should still be punished.
    Thanks from bajisima

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