View Poll Results: Should a President's pardon power be limited?

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    9 56.25%
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    7 43.75%
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Thread: Should a President's pardon power be limited?

  1. #21
    RNG
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    I have long thought that pardons of persons who were active in the current administration should not be allowed a pardon. The potential drawback is in case of an 8 year mandate, perhaps in the case of an obvious miscarriage of justice a correction would be delayed by at least 4 years.
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  2. #22
    the "good" prag pragmatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TennesseeRain View Post
    How about changing the rules because they are subject to abuse by criminal presidents? Is that better?
    Still going with nope.


    (But if Donald Trump turns out to be a "criminal president", am all in favor of prosecuting the rascal. Currently waiting to hear from Mueller on that one....)

  3. #23
    Veteran Member Devil505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pragmatic View Post
    Scooter Libbey's pardon translates to a Constitutional Crisis??

    Seems a little hyperbolic on your part.
    You well know that Libby's pardon was meant as a signal for Trump's co-conspirators to keep their mouths shut and wait for their pardon in turn.

    What would you say if Trump pardoned his son or even himself for any crimes they may have committed......as Ford's pardon of Nixon was worded?
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  4. #24
    Veteran Member Devil505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pragmatic View Post
    (But if Donald Trump turns out to be a "criminal president", am all in favor of prosecuting the rascal. Currently waiting to hear from Mueller on that one....)
    How will we ever know if Trump's attys prevail in arguing a sitting president can't be indicted or tried.......and the GOP won't impeach?
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  5. #25
    Human Bean KnotaFrayed's Avatar
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    Yes, since day one, this "power" has been controversial and revisiting it again would be no different than any former visitations of it, regarding its controversial use. Like most things, it is open to abuse. In other words, is it reasonable to say a President could not work to appoint corrupt members of his cabinet, with the idea that if they are caught and convicted of a crime, that President, can then simply pardon them?

    While a Presidential Pardon is perhaps intended to be a check and balance to a body of judicial actions, the controversy comes when one considers how the power could be abused, with few, if any checks to such power. If an investigation, judge and jury can be seen as flawed or null and void by a single person (the POTUS) then why can't the decision of a single person (the POTUS), be as equally flawed or something that could be null and voided?

    Even free speech is not without accountability.

    The other question is, do we the American people really understand how a pardon works, what it actually pardons and why a single person has power to pardon following an entire process of money, time and people working to bring justice to those then pardoned?

    https://www.justice.gov/pardon/legal...utive-clemency

    There is no doubt that there have been flawed convictions and a need for a retrial based on the discovered flaws or prejudices against the convicted, but to say our entire justice system and procedure can be dismissed without due process to determine a false conviction, then why wouldn't we simply be supporting the capacity of one person, with few checks and balances to prevent them, from pardoning all those convicted of illegalities that also aided those pardoning them?

    Where's the conflict of interest concern or checks and balances to reduce or prevent it?
    Last edited by KnotaFrayed; 15th April 2018 at 11:16 AM.

  6. #26
    the "good" prag pragmatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    You well know that Libby's pardon was meant as a signal for Trump's co-conspirators to keep their mouths shut and wait for their pardon in turn.

    What would you say if Trump pardoned his son or even himself for any crimes they may have committed......as Ford's pardon of Nixon was worded?
    You are apparently way better than me at precisely knowing what all of Trumps motivations are.

    (I thought it was more of The Donald being a doofus to piss off the Lefties. Which did seem to happen.)

  7. #27
    the "good" prag pragmatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    How will we ever know if Trump's attys prevail in arguing a sitting president can't be indicted or tried.......and the GOP won't impeach?

    How about we wait to see if "Trump's attorneys prevail"??

    Then we could have an actual topic to discuss...eh?

  8. #28
    Thought Provocateur NightSwimmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TennesseeRain View Post
    I disagree. The antiquated system whereby one person's vote counts more than another's is what broke our nation. Twice. Once, the black guy fixed it. This time? I'm not so sure.

    I'm no fan of the antiquated EC myself. That said, I'd put the odds of any of us actually getting the law changed regarding either presidential pardons or the EC at next to none. I suppose it's cathartic to vent anyway.
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  9. #29
    Trust Dusty Davocrat's Avatar
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    What is a president's pardon power currently?
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  10. #30
    Trust Dusty Davocrat's Avatar
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    Sorry. I'm too lazy to look it up.

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