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Thread: If you claim to be Christian.....Tell us....what did Christ teach

  1. #91
    Junior Member Gnostic Christian Bishop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    Hogwash.

    Constantine did not make christianity the state religion of the roman empire. He merely recognized it by his edict of milan. From there, christianity grew, making adherents of, first, women and slaves, and eventually intellectuals. Christianity became so widespread in a relatively short span of time that it supplanted paganism as the dominant religion in rome.

    It was theodosius who made it the authorized state religion by the edict of thessalonica more than half a century after. By then, the pre-eminence of christianity was already an accomplished fact -- state religion or not.

    Your inane statements come from gross errors in historical fact.
    You are correct on one point. The intellectuals were the last to join Christianity. That is why the intelligentsia today are the last people that you will see claim to be believers.

    Constantine put all kinds of laws favoring Christianity and against other religions and that power is how Christianity grew. It was not by moral authority and good arguments.

    Inquisitions were so much better. Perhaps that is why Christians are Christians. They followed force and not good moral thinking.

    Regards
    DL

  2. #92
    Junior Member Gnostic Christian Bishop's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=TNVolunteer73;5080760]
    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop View Post

    It grew long before nations adopted the christian faith, it grew from Jersusalem to Greece to rome to europe uk
    Irrelevant to the issue of Christianity growing by force after Constantine bought them out.

    As to Europe.



    Not to mention the Inquisition against Frances huge population of Gnostic Christians that took out half the population of northern France.

    All fond memories for Christians of their murderous heydays.

    Regards
    DL
    Last edited by Gnostic Christian Bishop; 22nd February 2017 at 04:54 AM.

  3. #93
    Veteran Member TNVolunteer73's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop View Post
    You are correct on one point. The intellectuals were the last to join Christianity. That is why the intelligentsia today are the last people that you will see claim to be believers.

    Constantine put all kinds of laws favoring Christianity and against other religions and that power is how Christianity grew. It was not by moral authority and good arguments.

    Inquisitions were so much better. Perhaps that is why Christians are Christians. They followed force and not good moral thinking.

    Regards
    DL
    but they did see the light.

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop View Post
    You are correct on one point. The intellectuals were the last to join Christianity. That is why the intelligentsia today are the last people that you will see claim to be believers.
    On the contrary, it is the educated who clearly sees how logically untenable, not to mention arrogant, atheism is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop View Post
    Constantine put all kinds of laws favoring Christianity and against other religions and that power is how Christianity grew. It was not by moral authority and good arguments.
    Again, you are showing everyone how truly ignorant you are about christian history. The edict of milan 313 ad merely put to halt the great persecution instituted by diocletian.

    313 The Edict of Milan | Christian History

    Provisions of the “Edict”
    The conference at Milan undoubtedly resulted in a concordat. But its terms are known to us only from a rescript issued six months later by Licinius.

    (This rescript was sent from his capital in Nicomedia—now Izmit in Turkey, just east of the Bosporus—to the governor of the nearby province of Bithynia. The Christian writer Lactantius has preserved its original Latin, while the church historian Eusebius gives it in Greek. )

    Here are the rescript’s main provisions:

    “Our purpose is to grant both to the Christians and to all others full authority to follow whatever worship each person has desired, whereby whatsoever Divinity dwells in heaven may be benevolent and propitious to us, and to all who are placed under our authority. Therefore we thought it salutary and most proper to establish our purpose that no person whatever should be refused complete toleration, who has given up his mind either to the cult of the Christians or to the religion which he personally feels best suited to himself. It is our pleasure to abolish all conditions whatever which were embodied in former orders directed to your office about the Christians, that every one of those who have a common wish to follow the religion of the Christians may from this moment freely and unconditionally proceed to observe the same without any annoyance or disquiet.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop View Post
    Inquisitions were so much better. Perhaps that is why Christians are Christians. They followed force and not good moral thinking.

    Regards
    DL
    Aren't you embarrassed yet at your ignorance of that part of history you pretend some sort of expertise on? Be my guest. What about the inquisition is making you go ape shit in the public domain, hmmm?

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by TNVolunteer73 View Post
    but they did see the light.
    Not when they remain homophobic and misogynous and not being forced to reformed by secular law.

    Hitler I am sure saw the light also before he died but that does not make the rest of his ideology moral.

    Regards
    DL

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    On the contrary, it is the educated who clearly sees how logically untenable, not to mention arrogant, atheism is.
    To brain dead sheeple, all free thinkers are arrogant.

    Better to be arrogant than to set aside ones intelligence by belief in supernatural B.S.

    Your selective memory tries to deflect us from the truth.

    Constantine’s laws against free thought and why Christianity became the Western religion.

    Here is some history. It's a list of Roman laws starting around Constantine’s time and extending forward from there.

    I'll bold and underline the killers for those with limited time.

    Quote:

    Fourth Century Christianity Home Imperial Laws and Letters Involving Religion AD, 364-395

    313CE Oct 31

    Certain catholic clerics are being harassed by heretics so that compulsory public services are too much for them to bear. They should be relieved of their civic duties, and replacements found, and in the future, clerics should not be forced to fulfill compulsory public services.

    318CE June 23

    Constantine gives Christians the right to take their cases before an ecclesiastical court rather than a secular court. The ruling of those bishops will carry the same authority as a secular court.

    325CE

    Constantine exhorts the Alexandrians to follow the Nicene faith, which he praises, and to disavow Arius, whom he condemns. The council is to be regarded as the will of God.

    326CE Sept 1

    Exemption from compulsory public services shall only be granted to clergy of the Catholic Church, and not to heretics or schismatics.

    327CE

    Constantine invites Arius to his court, where he may end his exile by confessing the Nicene faith before Constantine. Arius is allowed to use public transportation.

    333 or 327CE

    Constantine orders that Arians now be referred to as Porphyrians, that all works of Arius or Arians be burned, and that anyone hiding a work of Arius suffer capital punishment.

    Constantine sends a long, belittling letter to Arius and his followers. At the end, he threatens to heavily fine the Arians and force them to accept compulsory public services unless they immediately return to the catholic faith. If Arius returns, he promises to be lenient.

    341CE

    Pagan superstition and sacrifices are completely forbidden, in accord with the law set forth by Constantine.

    346CE Dec 1

    Pagan temples are to be closed; access to them is denied, and violators face capital punishment.
    The property of a violator will be given to the state treasury. Governors who fail to carry out this
    punishment will be punished.

    347CE

    The Donatists were ordered to be reconciled with the Catholic Church in North Africa. Those who refused were to be exiled or killed.

    352 July 3

    Persons who join Judaism from Christianity, if the accusation can be proven, shall have their property confiscated and given to the state treasury.

    353 Nov 23

    Night-time pagan sacrifices, which had briefly been allowed under the usurper Magnentius, are again forbidden.

    356 Feb 20

    Those guilty of idolatry or pagan sacrifices must suffer capital punishment.

    362

    Julian castigates the pagan Alexandrians, who had murdered Athanasius’ rival archbishop George when he ruined the temple of the local god Serapis. They should not have broken the law, but should have taken out their grievances legally.

    No Christians are allowed to teach the pagan classics (essentially debarring them from being teachers).
    Any student may study them, however.

    370CE Feb 17

    Laws formerly enacted against Christians under Julian shall have no validity, and policies of the late Constantius are to be upheld.

    372CE Mar 2

    Manichaeans and similar groups may not assemble. Their teachers will be punished, their followers segregated, and their places of gathering confiscated.

    377CE Oct 17

    Any who teaches a second baptism is to desist and be restored to the Catholic Church. The uncorrupted faith of the Evangelists and Apostles must be preserved. Furthermore, properties where re-baptizers or other expelled persons gather are to be confiscated.

    379 Aug 3

    All heresies are forbidden. One may hold to heretical teachings in his own mind but is forbidden to teach them to others, especially the teaching of re-baptism. Assemblies of those who hold to
    re-baptism are forbidden, and none may teach this doctrine.

    380CE Feb 28

    This edict is sometimes referred to as “Cunctos Populos.” Everyone in the empire shall be part of the religion that believes in God as a single Deity of Father, Son and Holy Spirit – the Holy Trinity, as taught by St. Peter to the Romans, and now taught by Damasus of Rome and Peter of Alexandria. Only those following this rule shall be called “Catholic Christians.”

    Meeting places of those who follow another religion (including heretics of a Christian variety) shall not be given the status of churches, and such people may be subject to both divine and earthly retribution.

    381 Jan 10

    Heretics shall have no place of meeting. Heretics are defined as those who do not observe the Nicene faith.
    The Phontinians, Arians, Eunomians and others are specified, but not exclusively. Their teachings are forbidden.
    A definition of the Trinity and the term ousia is established. Catholic churches throughout the empire are to be returned to orthodox bishops. Heretics are to be driven out of the churches and the cities.
    The property rights of Manichaeans are revoked, and property inherited from a Manichaean which should have been confiscated by the state is now to be confiscated. Manichaeans are forbidden to gather.

    381 May

    Christians who have converted to paganism shall not be allowed to make a will, and any will made by such a person is invalidated.

    Manichaeans may not inherit property or leave it to others through wills, and any property inherited from a Manichaean is to be confiscated. The only exception is the child of a Manichaean who converts to the Catholic faith. Also, Manichaean assemblies and sacraments are prohibited.

    381 July

    It is forbidden for Arians, Eunomians, or followers of Aetius to build churches.
    If any such churches are built, they will be confiscated.

    391CE

    Persons with inherited rank or status who abandon Christianity shall lose their position and be branded with infamy.

    Heretics are to be driven from cities, villages, and communities. They are not able to hold public meetings or secret gatherings.

    so on and so forth... the jackboot is in.

    Regards
    DL

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop View Post
    To brain dead sheeple, all free thinkers are arrogant.

    Better to be arrogant than to set aside ones intelligence by belief in supernatural B.S.

    Your selective memory tries to deflect us from the truth.

    Constantine’s laws against free thought and why Christianity became the Western religion.

    Here is some history. It's a list of Roman laws starting around Constantine’s time and extending forward from there.

    I'll bold and underline the killers for those with limited time.

    Quote:

    Fourth Century Christianity Home Imperial Laws and Letters Involving Religion AD, 364-395

    313CE Oct 31

    Certain catholic clerics are being harassed by heretics so that compulsory public services are too much for them to bear. They should be relieved of their civic duties, and replacements found, and in the future, clerics should not be forced to fulfill compulsory public services.

    318CE June 23

    Constantine gives Christians the right to take their cases before an ecclesiastical court rather than a secular court. The ruling of those bishops will carry the same authority as a secular court.

    325CE

    Constantine exhorts the Alexandrians to follow the Nicene faith, which he praises, and to disavow Arius, whom he condemns. The council is to be regarded as the will of God.

    326CE Sept 1

    Exemption from compulsory public services shall only be granted to clergy of the Catholic Church, and not to heretics or schismatics.

    327CE

    Constantine invites Arius to his court, where he may end his exile by confessing the Nicene faith before Constantine. Arius is allowed to use public transportation.

    333 or 327CE

    Constantine orders that Arians now be referred to as Porphyrians, that all works of Arius or Arians be burned, and that anyone hiding a work of Arius suffer capital punishment.

    Constantine sends a long, belittling letter to Arius and his followers. At the end, he threatens to heavily fine the Arians and force them to accept compulsory public services unless they immediately return to the catholic faith. If Arius returns, he promises to be lenient.

    341CE

    Pagan superstition and sacrifices are completely forbidden, in accord with the law set forth by Constantine.

    346CE Dec 1

    Pagan temples are to be closed; access to them is denied, and violators face capital punishment.
    The property of a violator will be given to the state treasury. Governors who fail to carry out this
    punishment will be punished.

    347CE

    The Donatists were ordered to be reconciled with the Catholic Church in North Africa. Those who refused were to be exiled or killed.

    352 July 3

    Persons who join Judaism from Christianity, if the accusation can be proven, shall have their property confiscated and given to the state treasury.

    353 Nov 23

    Night-time pagan sacrifices, which had briefly been allowed under the usurper Magnentius, are again forbidden.

    356 Feb 20

    Those guilty of idolatry or pagan sacrifices must suffer capital punishment.

    362

    Julian castigates the pagan Alexandrians, who had murdered Athanasius’ rival archbishop George when he ruined the temple of the local god Serapis. They should not have broken the law, but should have taken out their grievances legally.

    No Christians are allowed to teach the pagan classics (essentially debarring them from being teachers).
    Any student may study them, however.

    370CE Feb 17

    Laws formerly enacted against Christians under Julian shall have no validity, and policies of the late Constantius are to be upheld.

    372CE Mar 2

    Manichaeans and similar groups may not assemble. Their teachers will be punished, their followers segregated, and their places of gathering confiscated.

    377CE Oct 17

    Any who teaches a second baptism is to desist and be restored to the Catholic Church. The uncorrupted faith of the Evangelists and Apostles must be preserved. Furthermore, properties where re-baptizers or other expelled persons gather are to be confiscated.

    379 Aug 3

    All heresies are forbidden. One may hold to heretical teachings in his own mind but is forbidden to teach them to others, especially the teaching of re-baptism. Assemblies of those who hold to
    re-baptism are forbidden, and none may teach this doctrine.

    380CE Feb 28

    This edict is sometimes referred to as “Cunctos Populos.” Everyone in the empire shall be part of the religion that believes in God as a single Deity of Father, Son and Holy Spirit – the Holy Trinity, as taught by St. Peter to the Romans, and now taught by Damasus of Rome and Peter of Alexandria. Only those following this rule shall be called “Catholic Christians.”

    Meeting places of those who follow another religion (including heretics of a Christian variety) shall not be given the status of churches, and such people may be subject to both divine and earthly retribution.

    381 Jan 10

    Heretics shall have no place of meeting. Heretics are defined as those who do not observe the Nicene faith.
    The Phontinians, Arians, Eunomians and others are specified, but not exclusively. Their teachings are forbidden.
    A definition of the Trinity and the term ousia is established. Catholic churches throughout the empire are to be returned to orthodox bishops. Heretics are to be driven out of the churches and the cities.
    The property rights of Manichaeans are revoked, and property inherited from a Manichaean which should have been confiscated by the state is now to be confiscated. Manichaeans are forbidden to gather.

    381 May

    Christians who have converted to paganism shall not be allowed to make a will, and any will made by such a person is invalidated.

    Manichaeans may not inherit property or leave it to others through wills, and any property inherited from a Manichaean is to be confiscated. The only exception is the child of a Manichaean who converts to the Catholic faith. Also, Manichaean assemblies and sacraments are prohibited.

    381 July

    It is forbidden for Arians, Eunomians, or followers of Aetius to build churches.
    If any such churches are built, they will be confiscated.

    391CE

    Persons with inherited rank or status who abandon Christianity shall lose their position and be branded with infamy.

    Heretics are to be driven from cities, villages, and communities. They are not able to hold public meetings or secret gatherings.

    so on and so forth... the jackboot is in.

    Regards
    DL
    Constantine died in the spring of 337 AD.

    Uhmmm....duh?

  8. #98
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    Irrelevant to the direction and laws that his regime and following Emperors put in place.

    Regards
    DL

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop View Post
    Irrelevant to the direction and laws that his regime and following Emperors put in place.

    Regards
    DL
    That piece of fact is VERY relevant -- considering you are blaming constantine for laws enacted after his death -- relevant to the opinion that you are ignorant of the things you speak of here.

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