Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst ... 45678 LastLast
Results 51 to 60 of 75
Thanks Tree17Thanks

Thread: Was the Garden of Eden a case of "police entrapment"?

  1. #51
    Veteran Member GordonGecko's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    29,973
    Thanks
    22628

    From
    VA
    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    How would Adam and Eve have recognized Eden as a paradise? The whole idea of "paradise" is comparative, and there was nothing by which to compare.
    True, it's like somebody with no TV or movies or even books, who grew up and still lives in a gated community of 5000 square foot mansions and limitless wealth, being told "Be good or you'll get sent to a ghetto!"

    "What's a 'ghetto'???"
    Thanks from Djinn

  2. #52
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    42,240
    Thanks
    26917

    From
    Pennsylvania, USA
    Quote Originally Posted by font View Post
    You don't need to have "full understanding" of how car is constructed to drive it.
    No, but collectively, the society must have a full understanding of automobile construction in order for the car to be built in the first place.

    Consider this... what if you evolved on a world where the only habitable continent always faced the sun. Let's ignore all the technicalities of this, and pretend that it just works.

    Would the concept of "daytime" exist? Of course not. The only reason the term exists is because there's another concept "nighttime" with which to contrast it.

    Same goes for death. Adam and Eve had no idea what "death" was, since they had never experienced it themselves, nor had they seen the effects of death on others.
    Last edited by Djinn; 23rd March 2017 at 10:47 AM.

  3. #53
    Established Member
    Joined
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    6,557
    Thanks
    281

    From
    Irrelevant
    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    True; the serpent didn't say this. But God didn't either.
    God said adam and eve may eat the fruit of any try EXCEPT the tree of knowledge of good and evil -- for they will certainly die.

    How explicit does the command have to be?

  4. #54
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    42,240
    Thanks
    26917

    From
    Pennsylvania, USA
    Other things to note...

    First, Adam never spoke with God; not until after the whole tree fiasco. God spoke to Adam; but Adam posed no questions of his own.

    Second, God never commanded Eve not to eat from the forbidden tree. Look it up. In Genesis 2:17, God lays down the rule. And then, in Genesis 2:22, God creates Eve*. In fact, God never addresses Eve at any point in the narrative, until after the tree fiasco.

    The only entity who ever addressed Eve in any non-punitive capacity was the serpent.

    * He also apparently created both Adam and Eve at the same time, earlier in Genesis 1:27. Make of that what you will.
    Last edited by Djinn; 23rd March 2017 at 10:59 AM.

  5. #55
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    42,240
    Thanks
    26917

    From
    Pennsylvania, USA
    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    God said adam and eve may eat the fruit of any try EXCEPT the tree of knowledge of good and evil -- for they will certainly die.

    How explicit does the command have to be?
    By telling them what it means to die.

  6. #56
    Established Member
    Joined
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    6,557
    Thanks
    281

    From
    Irrelevant
    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    How would Adam and Eve have recognized Eden as a paradise? The whole idea of "paradise" is comparative, and there was nothing by which to compare.
    Of course not.

    Adam and eve knew animals because they were given dominion over them.

    Adam and eve knew god, whose power and authority was clear.

    Wasn't this the thing that the serpent used to seduce them to disobedience -- that partaking of the fruit would open their eyes and be like god?

  7. #57
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    42,240
    Thanks
    26917

    From
    Pennsylvania, USA
    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    Of course not.

    Adam and eve knew animals because they were given dominion over them.

    Adam and eve knew god, whose power and authority was clear.

    Wasn't this the thing that the serpent used to seduce them to disobedience -- that partaking of the fruit would open their eyes and be like god?
    How was god's power and authority clear? What had God done to demonstrate either of these? Don't forget; Adam was asleep when Eve was created. And unlike God, the serpent had not only demonstrated the ability to speak, but also to listen and respond.

  8. #58
    Established Member
    Joined
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    6,557
    Thanks
    281

    From
    Irrelevant
    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    By telling them what it means to die.
    Do you follow god's commandment for an anticipated reward or for the love of god?

  9. #59
    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    42,240
    Thanks
    26917

    From
    Pennsylvania, USA
    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    Do you follow god's commandment for an anticipated reward or for the love of god?
    I don't follow the commandments of any god, unless they happen to coincide with societal rules. And I expect nothing from any gods, reward or otherwise. If any gods need something from me (which seems unlikely given the purported nature of gods), they know how to reach me.

  10. #60
    New Member
    Joined
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    662
    Thanks
    300

    From
    Israel
    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    No, but collectively, the society must have a full understanding of automobile construction in order for the car to be built in the first place.

    Consider this... what if you evolved on a world where the only habitable continent always faced the sun. Let's ignore all the technicalities of this, and pretend that it just works.

    Would the concept of "daytime" exist? Of course not. The only reason the term exists is because there's another concept "nighttime" with which to contrast it.

    Same goes for death. Adam and Eve had no idea what "death" was, since they had never experienced it themselves, nor had they seen the effects of death on others.
    After his creation, Adam had zero experience. ZERO.
    Quote Originally Posted by font View Post
    Adam was constructed to understand anything God said him.

Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst ... 45678 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 253
    Last Post: 4th November 2016, 09:46 PM
  2. Trump "Shames" Fed Judge Hearing "Trump U" Case
    By Friday13 in forum Current Events
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 29th May 2016, 07:54 PM
  3. Was the real Jewish Garden of Eden located in Jerusalem?
    By Gnostic Christian Bishop in forum Philosophy and Religion
    Replies: 71
    Last Post: 11th June 2015, 07:22 AM
  4. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 30th August 2007, 12:44 PM

Tags for this Thread


Facebook Twitter RSS Feed