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Thread: Judaism does avoid the inherent contraditions of Christianity on the "Biblical God"..

  1. #21
    Veteran Member GordonGecko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaos View Post
    After hundreds of years of occupation, exile, and war, there had to be a few rabbis who saw the benefits of a gentle man-god. A prince of peace who had to suffer to fulfil the prophecy of the messiah.

    This spiritual harmony of accord would mean that we are no longer the enemy of god.

    Obviously Christianity had a great "selling product" to 1st Century Jews (the Apostles of course, being the first) (And naturally later to "Gentiles"/Romans/etc).

    I see it in the same manner as the Protestant Reformation that came 1500 years later. Just as Catholicism had become stagnant, even corrupt....it seems that Judaism had similar problems around "Zero A.D." and thus a message like Jesus' had appeal.

    And of course, it also helped replace the other "sacrificing animal guts to a capricious God" religions of the polytheists of Greece and Rome.



    And like Catholicism after the Reformation....Judaism "quasi-reformed" itself to insure its survival, still confident that Jews were "God's chosen people...even if Man had failed the faith".


    But at its core, Judaism still relied (and still relies today) on the same brutal, tribalistic, even homicidal psychotic named "Jehovah"
    Thanks from chaos

  2. #22
    Junior Member Gnostic Christian Bishop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaos View Post
    After hundreds of years of occupation, exile, and war, there had to be a few rabbis who saw the benefits of a gentle man-god. A prince of peace who had to suffer to fulfil the prophecy of the messiah.

    This spiritual harmony of accord would mean that we are no longer the enemy of god.
    Eh, the Jewish prophesy had their messiah rising again and living and leading them. Not dying and never returning.

    That is why Jesus was soundly rejected as messiah by the Jews.

    Regards
    DL
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  3. #23
    Junior Member Gnostic Christian Bishop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
    Forget carpe, Gnostic.

    Like many Christians....he NEVER examines his beliefs with any critical thought, and thus just does a knee-jerk "Neener-neener" when asked to defend them.
    I hear you but thought I would see if he can think at all with logic and reason.

    Regards
    DL

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop
    Karaite Jews do. The oral Torah tradition to them, can override anything the written Torah gives.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karaite_Judaism
    Next time try to read at least once your own link:
    "Karaite Jews do not accept as binding the written collections of the oral tradition in the Midrash or Talmud."
    I don't care about your "interpretation" of mainstream Judaism or its different sects. You are not authorized to teach Jews their own religion and you have not the faintest idea what it is.

  5. #25
    Junior Member Gnostic Christian Bishop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by font View Post
    Next time try to read at least once your own link:
    "Karaite Jews do not accept as binding the written collections of the oral tradition in the Midrash or Talmud."
    I don't care about your "interpretation" of mainstream Judaism or its different sects. You are not authorized to teach Jews their own religion and you have not the faintest idea what it is.
    Learn to read.

    Since you cannot, perhaps if you get it from the horses mouth.



    It is unfortunately a long explanation but the 20 min. mark on is the main message.

    Further.

    Bill Moyers Journal . Watch & Listen | PBS

    Rabbi Hillel, the older contemporary of Jesus, said that when asked to sum up the whole of Jewish teaching, while he stood on one leg, said, "The Golden Rule. That which is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. That is the Torah. And everything else is only commentary. Now, go and study it."

    Please listen as to what is said about literal reading.

    "Origen, the great second or third century Greek commentator on the Bible said that it is absolutely impossible to take these texts literally. You simply cannot do so. And he said, "God has put these sort of conundrums and paradoxes in so that we are forced to seek a deeper meaning."

    Jews are generally not foolish enough to believe their text literally. That is partially why, (I think), Israel means to strive both for and against God.

    Regards
    DL

  6. #26
    Swamper chaos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
    Obviously Christianity had a great "selling product" to 1st Century Jews (the Apostles of course, being the first) (And naturally later to "Gentiles"/Romans/etc).
    Great post. My only disagreement would be your 1st Century date. By then Judaism was a lot different after 700 years of war. Most scholars I read credit Assyrians for modern Judaism but to me it was the Greek occupation (332-167 BCE) that transformed the angry war god into a gentle man-god.


    From Wikipedia
    The exilic period was a rich one for Hebrew literature. Biblical depictions of the exile include Book of Jeremiah 3943 (which saw the exile as a lost opportunity)

    In the late 7th century BCE, the kingdom of Judah was a client state of the Assyrian empire. In the last decades of the century, Assyria was overthrown by Babylon, an Assyrian province.

    Archaeological studies have revealed that not all of the population of Judah was deported, and that, although Jerusalem was utterly destroyed, other parts of Judah continued to be inhabited during the period of the exile. The return of the exiles was a gradual process rather than a single event, and many of the deportees or their descendants did not return.
    -------------------------------

    Around 250 BCE, just west of the Kingdom of Aram-Damascus is where several rabbis started to teach about the gentle man-god. The timeline is important because it shows the Greek influence on both Judaism and Gnosticism.


  7. #27
    Veteran Member GordonGecko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaos View Post
    snip

    Great post. My only disagreement would be your 1st Century date. By then Judaism was a lot different after 700 years of war. Most scholars I read credit Assyrians for modern Judaism but to me it was the Greek occupation (332-167 BCE) that transformed the angry war god into a gentle man-god.
    I think it was a desire for reform among those trapped in a static, even increasingly corrupt religion.

    Same way Catholicism and its politics and things like "indulgences" led the way for Protestantism.

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