Members banned from this thread: Czernobog


Page 28 of 29 FirstFirst ... 1826272829 LastLast
Results 271 to 280 of 290
Thanks Tree79Thanks

Thread: What is the purpose of prayer?

  1. #271
    Established Member
    Joined
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    6,582
    Thanks
    281

    From
    Irrelevant
    Quote Originally Posted by Czernobog View Post
    Okay. I guess what I am trying to understand is what is the specific purpose of prayer? What does prayer accomplish that can't be accomplished by, say, deep breathing exercises, and centering?

    "Hope, finding inner strength, speaking to a higher power, etc is what is being accomplished... to ultimately move forward, move on, something."

    Okay. This is meaningless gibberish. You are saying that prayer accomplishes praying. REALLY?!?!? So, what you are saying is that praying for something actually has no real, demonstrable effect, other than "It makes you feel better,".
    Exactly!

    Did you expect god to bend the laws of nature on your behalf? Or don't you think feeling better is a demonstrable effect?

    You do understand people pump potentially harmful chemicals into their bodies for precisely that reason-- to feel happy, don't you?

  2. #272
    Established Member
    Joined
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    6,582
    Thanks
    281

    From
    Irrelevant
    Quote Originally Posted by Czernobog View Post
    I don't claim to know any such thing. But you still aren't trying to convince anyone that your continued belief in a book of Mythology is reasonable. Why is that?
    But you admitted it yourself. Prayer makes people feel happy.

    Some people pop anti-depressants just to 'feel happy' so why wouldn't prayer be reasonable when it accrues to the same thing, hmmm?

  3. #273
    Veteran Member aboutenough's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    51,783
    Thanks
    2799

    From
    Washington state
    Quote Originally Posted by Czernobog View Post
    I don't claim to know any such thing. But you still aren't trying to convince anyone that your continued belief in a book of Mythology is reasonable. Why is that?
    You claim to know what a Christians views are before anyone states it, then you go on and argue against it before they even speak. You are basically having an argument with yourself. I feel like a bystander in that conversation.

  4. #274
    Veteran Member Czernobog's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    34,843
    Thanks
    17364

    From
    Phoenix, AZ
    Quote Originally Posted by aboutenough View Post
    You claim to know what a Christians views are before anyone states it, then you go on and argue against it before they even speak. You are basically having an argument with yourself. I feel like a bystander in that conversation.
    Demonstrate that. Post anything I have said that was not a direct result of your statements.

  5. #275
    Wrinkly Member Dangermouse's Avatar
    Joined
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    21,757
    Thanks
    19693

    From
    Sunny Bournemouth, Dorset
    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    25 years of studying christianity and you still need to ask?

    Prayer is a conversation (except that one party is the divine). You cannot see the practical necessities of a conversation?
    The minimum requirement for a conversation is two or more active participants. Otherwise you're talking to yourself.
    Thanks from Czernobog and Panzareta

  6. #276
    Veteran Member Czernobog's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    34,843
    Thanks
    17364

    From
    Phoenix, AZ
    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    25 years of studying christianity and you still need to ask?

    Prayer is a conversation (except that one party is the divine). You cannot see the practical necessities of a conversation?
    Your answer is meaningless. "Prayer is a conversation" that there is no evidence of. You see, a conversation require two active participants. At best, prayer is a monologue, as there is no objective evidence of. I do see the practical necessity of a conversation. I do not, however, see any evidence that prayer is a conversation. Please demonstrate that I am mistaken. Demonstrate objective evidence of a a "conversation" with God. Not of people praying, but objective evidence of God responding. Because without a response, it isn't a conversation.

    And you fall feel free to fuck off with your constant passive aggressive attacks on my 25 years of experience with Christianity. All it does is demonstrate that you are clearly threatened by the fact that the irrational, illogical nature of the mythology you take so seriously is being exposed.

  7. #277
    Veteran Member Czernobog's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    34,843
    Thanks
    17364

    From
    Phoenix, AZ
    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    Exactly!

    Did you expect god to bend the laws of nature on your behalf? Or don't you think feeling better is a demonstrable effect?

    You do understand people pump potentially harmful chemicals into their bodies for precisely that reason-- to feel happy, don't you?
    Yes, I do understand that - and it is just as irrational. So, you admit that you willingly engage in irrational, useless behaviour.

    Good for you for recognising your irrational behaviour. That is a first step.

  8. #278
    Veteran Member aboutenough's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    51,783
    Thanks
    2799

    From
    Washington state
    Quote Originally Posted by Czernobog View Post
    Demonstrate that. Post anything I have said that was not a direct result of your statements.
    The whole OP is your opinion about what Christians think. You then want a Christian to give you clarification of what you think, because you feel its wrong. Don't really seem to open to what anyone thinks, because you are convinced you are right.

  9. #279
    Veteran Member Czernobog's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    34,843
    Thanks
    17364

    From
    Phoenix, AZ
    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    But you admitted it yourself. Prayer makes people feel happy.

    Some people pop anti-depressants just to 'feel happy' so why wouldn't prayer be reasonable when it accrues to the same thing, hmmm?
    I didn't say it makes them "happy"; those were your words. I said my understanding of Johnflesh's explanation was that praying makes the people doing the praying feel better. In times of stress theists pray, so that they can feel better, and be less stressed. But you see, that makes prayer dangerous. It's dangerous because that better feeling, that reduction of stress is created by false hope. It is created by the false hope that someone, or something is out there caring who is going to make a difference. Now, when that doesn't happen; when the loved one dies, or the job, or job promotion doesn't come along, then, depending on the denomination, the person who was praying are told, either it was their fault - oh, don't misunderstand, it's never that blunt; its more, not enough faith, or there was some hidden doubt, or sin that prevented the expected outcome, but the result is the same; it was their fault - which reinforces the self-loathing of the believer ("Thank God for his eternal love and grace, as I know how unworthy I am"; fyi "unworthy" is just a softcore way of saying "worthless"). Or they person praying is given some bullshit about God "working in mysterious ways", again letting God off the hook. But, what they are never told is that God wasn't there, wasn't listening, or doesn't exist, and your prayers were only meant to calm you down, and make you feel better. Because if that is ever admitted then people would start to realise the utter uselessness of prayer.

    So, if you want to use prayer to make you "feel better" during times of stress, then why bother. Why not just accept that things happen as they happen? Acceptance of your own limitations to effect outcomes with factors that are beyond your control an be just as effective at reducing stress, and is more honest that praying to a non-existent, or uncaring deity.
    Last edited by Czernobog; 10th December 2017 at 07:57 PM.

  10. #280
    Veteran Member Czernobog's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    34,843
    Thanks
    17364

    From
    Phoenix, AZ
    Quote Originally Posted by aboutenough View Post
    The whole OP is your opinion about what Christians think. You then want a Christian to give you clarification of what you think, because you feel its wrong. Don't really seem to open to what anyone thinks, because you are convinced you are right.
    No it's not. The OP is about someone explaining the usefulness of intercessory prayer. I did not presume anything about what believers believe. I was very specific that the schools of thought on intercessory prayer were gleaned from actual conversations with believers. So, if I am relating what believers themselves had said about prayer, how is that "my opinion" about what Christians think?

    And if those descriptions of how intercessory prayer works were inaccurate, why don't you simply correct the misconceptions, and tell us how intercessory does work, and what its purpose is, instead of whining that I "got it wrong"?

Page 28 of 29 FirstFirst ... 1826272829 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. What is the purpose for prayer?
    By Katiegrrl0 in forum Philosophy and Religion
    Replies: 111
    Last Post: 13th December 2010, 07:15 AM
  2. what is the purpose of ego?
    By nonsqtr in forum Philosophy and Religion
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 7th October 2009, 07:03 PM
  3. Purpose of Life
    By Socrates Was Right in forum Philosophy and Religion
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: 5th June 2007, 11:01 PM

Tags for this Thread


Facebook Twitter RSS Feed