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Thread: What is the purpose of prayer?

  1. #21
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Does the mind have any power we have yet to discover? Does the positive feelings of others have any impact on a patient with an organic disease?

    I think maybe......
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    Council Member Djinn's Avatar
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Does the mind have any power we have yet to discover? Does the positive feelings of others have any impact on a patient with an organic disease?

    I think maybe......
    Chicken or the egg...consciousness or matter? I'm happiest when I am in a place where I understand it just doesn't matter, that it's all good, whatever the answer may be. But certainly we have no real idea what the nature of reality itself is, and therefore we really cannot know what limits there are on our minds or what we can achieve.
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    Veteran Member Devil505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Does the mind have any power we have yet to discover? Does the positive feelings of others have any impact on a patient with an organic disease?

    I think maybe......
    So there is no need for god, right?
    Just the belief is what heels?

  5. #25
    Veteran Member Devil505's Avatar
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    I have nothing against those who take comfort from prayer but don't ask me to believe in supernatural things without real evidence.
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    Veteran Member Czernobog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    O yes, they did and do.

    There are some interesting studies on the better outcomes of prayed-for patients. Lots of theories as to why that might be, but still.

    Interesting.
    Actually, there's a paper that recently pointed out the studies that may indicate the exact opposite. While there were two studies that demonstrated that prayer had a nominally positive effect, three others demonstrated that prayer had no effect, or actually made things worse. Then there was one whose methodology was so bad that its results were unreliable.
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    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djinn View Post
    LOL. I have a copy of the Devil's Dictionary. It's awesome.
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  8. #28
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Czernobog View Post
    Actually, there's a paper that recently pointed out the studies that may indicate the exact opposite. While there were two studies that demonstrated that prayer had a nominally positive effect, three others demonstrated that prayer had no effect, or actually made things worse. Then there was one whose methodology was so bad that its results were unreliable.
    Naturally, there is no way to really test such a hypothesis, since causation could never be established. There is no way to know, for example, whether a nominally bad outcome would have been better or worse with prayer than without it, or vice versa.

    One description of the Jewish approach to prayer can be found here.

  9. #29
    RNG
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    O yes, they did and do.

    There are some interesting studies on the better outcomes of prayed-for patients. Lots of theories as to why that might be, but still.

    Interesting.
    When it is a binary study that is true. But other studies that look at other factors show that a positive attitude and tranquility are the important factors. Yes, prayer can achieve that. But so can just an intrinsic positive attitude, a good sense of humor and meditation.

    I know of one study, on cancer patients that looked at those factors. The best was yoga type meditation. Mrs. RNG was involved in the study and they got to the point of wanting to publish a preliminary paper in order to get more money for a larger study when the provincial government at the time, that was overly populated by the fundie menace got wind of that and forced it to be deep sixed. This was a provincial hospital and provincial employees.

  10. #30
    RNG
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    Quote Originally Posted by splansing View Post
    You can petition the Lord with prayer....
    A friend of mine tells me he read this on Facebook.

    "I went to church and repeatedly prayed for a bicycle. Again and again. It didn't work. So I stole a bicycle, went to church and prayed for forgiveness." Or words to that effect.

    I have always loved that.
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