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Thread: Atheist answer to the 10 Commandments: 10 Rational positions.

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by StanStill View Post
    So is it wrong because it is a commandment (that is to say, is it wrong because God made it wrong), or is it wrong for some other reason?
    It isn't wrong for all other animals, now, is it? In fact, killing is necessary for animals to survive. It is only wrong for human beings. But a human being, as far as science is concerned, is merely another specie of animal. So what makes it wrong for our specie and right for all others?

    Kant made an argument that starts with the nature of rational agents, which I find lacking in justification. The only justification I can think of is the christian justification -- that man is the only creature god created for its own sake, hence deserving a certain level of dignity within his nature.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Czernobog View Post
    You're talking about laws. The 10 Rational Positions are not meant to be a set of laws. They are a set of proposed moral concepts. This is another problem promulgated by Christianity, and religion in general. It blurs the line between morality, and legality. Laws are not meant to be a set of personal moral precepts; laws are a set of agreed upon social rules in order to allow people to form amenable societies. While some of those laws may include reasonable moral propositions, they are not, themselves, meant to be approached as a personal moral code.
    So now it is not merely a 'response' to the ten commandments, rather, moral concepts (or the framework thereof), which is what the ten commandments are.

    Your intellectual dishonesty is astounding!

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael J View Post
    The title is "Atheist answer to the 10 Commandments."
    But the op admitted it himself -- that they are moral concepts like the 10 commandments.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by StanStill View Post
    You could even say that itís common sense. Practically part of our DNA. Why else would people all over the planet, and throughout recorded history, repeat this rule? Incidentally, most animals obey the same rule, most with about the same amount of exceptions. Ants have wars. Male goats fight, often to the death, to be top buck. But in general, birds of a feather flock together, and schools of fish swim together, and usually band together for protection against predators, or the elements. They know not to kill each other because it goes against their survival. Itís inherent.



    In my opinion, itís a natural law.
    But the concept of natural law presupposes a creator. How do you reconcile this fact with the thread?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Czernobog View Post


    They. Are not. Commandments. They are rational positions.....
    But you just said they were moral concepts.

    Is there no end to your dishonesty?

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael J View Post
    It is like I said earlier, he doesn't understand anything outside of his totalitarian dogma.
    And I suppose you could explain how a rational positions are moral concepts and how the 10 commandments are not moral concepts hence are not rational positions?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Religious people, such as the Catholics who are (supposed to) oppose stem cell research, or the Christian Scientists who refuse medical care even for their kids.
    Catholics are opposed to EMBRYONIC stem cell research for the simple reason that a human being exists from conception, hence deserving the same level of human dignity afforded to everyone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by StanStill View Post
    Are we only allowed to respond to questions? That seems kind of restrictive.

    Debates would be pretty short if that were enforced.
    But the op stated that his 'response' is not, in themselves, commandments. Because if they are not commandments, in themselves, what is the point of stating them, hmmmm?

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    But the concept of natural law presupposes a creator. How do you reconcile this fact with the thread?
    Admittedly, I was using the term a bit loosely (I did intentionally say "it's a natural law" not "I think it's part of Natural Law"). The philosophy of Natural Law predates evolutionary theory. How do you reconcile the rest of my post, leaving out the sloppy use of the term?

    Why don't any animals need laws or religion or codified morality to inform them on how they should behave? Where does their morality come from?

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    Anarquistador StanStill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingrat View Post
    But the op stated that his 'response' is not, in themselves, commandments. Because if they are not commandments, in themselves, what is the point of stating them, hmmmm?
    You're going in circles here. If you put out a list of laws for people to obey in order to be deemed good, and I respond with a list of things that should be guidelines that people use to decide on what the best course of action is in life because I think that people are not so intellectually stupid to need commands to tell them what to do, is my response invalid because I think the premise of your list of laws is misguided and archaic?

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