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Thread: Marine LePen Sounded Okay To Me

  1. #31
    Little Old Lady Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasselas View Post
    Depends on what the goods are, and the price difference.

    If we don't participate in the global economy, we make ourselves less competitive, we deny ourselves other markets, and we encourage other markets to develop better products and more efficiencies that we won't participate in. Ultimately, our standard of living and our ability to invent and innovate (something that's been a massive advantage for us up to this point--our "secret sauce," some call it) will suffer.

    It's a short-sighted, short-term gain, long-term loss. And economics suggests what I'm saying is inevitable.

    By the way, China would like nothing better--long term--than for us to withdraw from all the markets they'd like to dominate.
    The US is the biggest consumer on the planet. Why would it be error for Americans to protect our workers from competition from child and slave labor made goods?
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  2. #32
    He JUST FUCKED up AGAIN! BAZINGA DrumpF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paris View Post
    Dasvidanya, Tovarisch!

    ?? Hello Comrade ??

  3. #33
    Human Bean KnotaFrayed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by THOR View Post
    It's not just Muslims we need a pause on. All poverty immigration. We have our own poor, those in need. Piling on more poverty and warehousing them in big apartment blocks like Somali's in Minneapolis is stupid.
    We need to clean up our own situation. You can NEVER undo the world's poverty by bringing them here. If you have a big heart for the world's poverty, GIVE TO CHARITY. Fat chance of that.
    Who's gonna pick your lettuce? You? Or are you going to pay a lot more for your food, your hotel rooms, your lawn mower, gardener or housemaid to help prevent poverty? The reality is, charities worry that when religions get too involved in politics, they may get push back and not only their exemption from being taxed being ended, but the write-off the "charitable" "church goers" seem to need to donate to charity, will be removed and hurt the needy. How many "pro-lifers" that whine about welfare also whine about money being given to the needy via churches and charity organizations? Are they asking for recipients of charitable contributions be drug tested? Are they asking to see where and how they spend any money they may receive or checking to see the recipients are not pawning any goods they receive so they can buy cigs or booze or other drugs? Are they checking to see they only eat gruel, not anything that might taste good because being poor they can't eat well, like the greedy, gluttonous, selfish, self-centered billionaire adulterer, President?

    I agree, we need to clean up the BS and people that spew it and educate people so they don't elect a greedy, gluttonous, fraudulent, narcissistic, adulterer billionaire thinking that is the solution to cleaning up our own situation. Our own situation has been around a long time and long before refugees wanting to come here from war torn places or immigrants from the south....Ask any of the First People, when the "situation" got bad for their people and who caused it. You'll either be welcomed as a someone sharing their misery or as a descendant of some who caused it.
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  4. #34
    Human Bean KnotaFrayed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    The US is the biggest consumer on the planet. Why would it be error for Americans to protect our workers from competition from child and slave labor made goods?
    It's not that simple.

    China surpasses U.S. to become largest world economy | Fox News

    First, the people calling for "America First", like the President and his daughter, have to build factories here in the U.S. to pay American workers more to make their products. That's called putting their money where their big mouths are. Second, unless Americans buy only American goods and services, buying stuff made in other nations, by companies registered in other nations, will still be supporting other nation's economies and child and slave labor in those nations. The sale of American goods overseas will be subjected to import taxes making goods and services from places like China preferable by price point alone.

    It's a global market for sure and it is not likely to change from that, so solutions other than isolationism are needed. Nothing wrong with strong support of American workers and products, but in a global market, they have to be better and cheaper and while American innovation can come up with better things, cheaper is going to be a problem because other nations do not have the same standards (or at least the same standards we did have, before Trump) regarding protection of the environment and the workers themselves and that is way American companies (including the Trumps) have been hiring cheaper labor, both abroad and here (undocumented) to "compete", but their doing so has also helped to raise the economies of other nations where there is a huge disparity in standard of living and basic pay. Eventually workers in other nations will want higher pay and better working conditions and where labor is now cheap, labor will become more expensive or automation will take millions of jobs away and there will only be the super wealthy and the mostly unemployed on the planet.

    As China and India have found out, having billions of people in population creates inherent problems. China banned second children of a certain gender for a long time and then realized that simply caused another problem in the opposite direction. The combination of over population, automation and the uber wealthy collecting and hoarding wealth is increasing the haves and have nots division on the planet. Add automation to the equation and there becomes less a need for human laborers and higher unemployment, since not everyone in the world can or will be a computer programmer. Even if all current labor were to be retrained to become computer programmers, advances in automation will make even computer/machine programmers obsolete and until then, there still won't be a need for untrained or unskilled labor, not matter how much Donald Trump likes the uneducated because they are easier to con.
    Last edited by KnotaFrayed; 6th March 2017 at 09:06 PM.
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  5. #35
    vulgar? Rasselas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    The US is the biggest consumer on the planet. Why would it be error for Americans to protect our workers from competition from child and slave labor made goods?
    If you could isolate child and slave labor from the rest, that would be great. I don't think that's what anyone has suggested in terms of protectionist policies.

    Again, capitalism. Every nation has competitive advantages--for some it's relatively poor, very large populations.
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  6. #36
    Little Old Lady Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasselas View Post
    If you could isolate child and slave labor from the rest, that would be great. I don't think that's what anyone has suggested in terms of protectionist policies.

    Again, capitalism. Every nation has competitive advantages--for some it's relatively poor, very large populations.
    Why can't we put the burden on the nation trying to import goods here, to prove the goods are not child or slave made?
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  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Why can't we put the burden on the nation trying to import goods here, to prove the goods are not child or slave made?
    That's exactly what we should do.

    It makes zero sense to write labor laws then create trade policies that reward businesses that move offshore to escape those very same laws.

    If other countries want to ruin their economic growth/standard of living by competing with slave labor then by all means they can go knock themselves out. But there is no good reason why we should do it.
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    I have to say this once again, your views are very odd, for a Serb lol

    And I ain't saying this in a bad way, you are entitled to feel as you do, and I frankly agree with much of what you say about Le Pen.

    But to hear a Serb express a dislike of Putin and Russia and support for Muslim Arab immigrants to Europe is... hilarious, frankly
    I have very good reason to dislike Putin. I have nothing against Russia or its people, which I have mentioned many times before. However, I am very weary of the Russian political elites currently in power because they are actively fomenting trouble in the Balkans. Just look at what they're doing/have done in Republika Srpska in Bosna i Hercegovina, and what they've done just last year in Montenegro (Crna Gora).

    They're not doing it out of love for the Serbian people. They're doing it for their own selfish gains.

    You're presenting this as a false dichotomy. If I'm against Le Pen that means I am for Muslim Arab immigrants in Europe. I don't care where the immigrants come from, as long as they come legally. Millions have entered Europe over the past decade illegally. That is the main problem. Not the colour of their skin or their religion. Le Pen focuses on skin and religion instead of the underlying issue.

    Even that whole issue aside, France out of the EU destroys the EU and creates instability on the European continent that would inevitably lead to war. German government is already pushing for German nuclear armament. They're not discussing it openly, but they're moving in that direction. They need a nuclear deterrent against Russia. Those are their words not mine.

    Putin is actively financing her. Her main rival's campaign, Emmanuel Macron, has suffered more than 4.000 hacking attempts already. Macron announced his campaign in December. That means his campaign has had to deal with over 45 hacks a day. That's a shitload and hardly something his political rivals in France would be able to sustain over such a long period of time. With all that Le Pen stands for, and with all the implications that has for the continent and my country, how should I feel about Putin and his Russian cronies? They're actively working to destabilize the region and the whole continent. To hell with them.
    Thanks from Madeline, The Man and tnbskts

  9. #39
    res
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Why can't we put the burden on the nation trying to import goods here, to prove the goods are not child or slave made?
    Because you are a party to the WTO.

    What you're suggesting was attempted with the Doha round of WTO negotiations but the talks broke down around 2008.

    One of the main reasons for that was US, Canadian and EU resistance to lowering their agricultural subsidies.

    As a consumer your best bet right now would be to organize a CSR campaign boycotting goods not produced without slave labour. That means, no more cars, laptops, computers, smart phones, or any such gadget which is highly dependent on raw material coming from the mines of countries like DR Congo where child slave labourers are used to extract cobalt and similar minerals from the ground.

    https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/ne...car-batteries/
    Child labor in the mines of the Democratic Republic of Congo | Humanium ? Together for Children?s Rights
    https://www.dol.gov/agencies/ilab/re...ratic-republic

    Write to your congressman or senator and reignite the fire under their asses to renew Doha negotiations. However, the current world climate being what it is, odds of that happening are extremely slim.
    Thanks from Madeline and BigLeRoy

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasselas View Post
    Depends on what the goods are, and the price difference.

    If we don't participate in the global economy, we make ourselves less competitive, we deny ourselves other markets, and we encourage other markets to develop better products and more efficiencies that we won't participate in. Ultimately, our standard of living and our ability to invent and innovate (something that's been a massive advantage for us up to this point--our "secret sauce," some call it) will suffer.

    It's a short-sighted, short-term gain, long-term loss. And economics suggests what I'm saying is inevitable.

    By the way, China would like nothing better--long term--than for us to withdraw from all the markets they'd like to dominate.
    You have already done that.

    Trump withdrawing from the TPP has turned the entire Asia Pacific to China. The Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement is expected to be signed and implemented by the end of the year. The US influence was already shrinking in the Pacific and the TPP was Obama's attempt to shore off any further spread of Chinese influence in the region. With Trump withdrawing from it immediately upon entering White House, the whole region is now turning to China which wasn't even intended to be a part of RCEP when the ASEAN countries and their neighbours began the negotiations but only entered a couple of years ago after TPP was well underway.
    Thanks from Madeline and BigLeRoy

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