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Thread: Bernie's Popularity Soars -- Except With Democrats

  1. #61
    vulgar? Rasselas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bajisima View Post
    Yet had more democratic presidents than GOP ones since then?
    Between 1932 and 1995, the GOP held majorities in the House for just 2 sessions, I think. Since 1995, Dems have held control for just two sessions. That's where the real power is.
    Why are we moving further right? Boomers aging? Something else?
    Reagan probably made the biggest jump. And there have been rapid changes in our society--in technology, in demographics, in the social attitudes of the young. That tends to create an opposite reaction in others who are unwilling or unable to deal with the changes around them.

    Also, there has been both a systematic and organic political devaluing of urban versus rural areas.
    Last edited by Rasselas; 17th March 2017 at 01:40 PM.
    Thanks from Madeline and Panzareta

  2. #62
    Chaos in fourteen lines Minotaur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoom View Post
    The time has never been better to fight for universal care? It's never been worse. The only national party with any hopes of passing it, the democrats, are at their lowest levels of representation in nearly a century.
    Voters either want it and show it with their votes or they don't want it and show it with their votes. If the last election was an indication, not only do they not want universal healthcare still but they also want to be punished like children by electing the worse candidate ever seen to accomplish that. I'm not sure voters realize how important they are when they run off on pipe dreams in spite of the reality. THEY are the ones responsible for exactly what they voted into office whether they stayed home, voted third party or voted Trump.

    You are correct though that now is the worse time to even pretend universal care is possible. Not sure these people understand how hard it was to get the ACA passed that could eventually lead to universal in some form. In too many minds these things can happen just because they want it. Then they vote like what they want is to undo any advances. It is a barnyard I tell ya. lol

  3. #63
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minotaur View Post
    Meaningless Fox poll but I must say I do credit those who still haven't accepted the fact that Bernie did not even win the primary though Hillary treated him with kid gloves. He was never vetted by Republicans who found him useful. It is a drumbeat a portion of Bernie voters still don't get and no one should expect them to realize they messed up big time in the last election. I don't mind saying this is particularly irritating as it seems some relying on Fox simply live in a bubble. Look at all the people suffering today because of that attitude. Wish you all listened to Bernie when he told you to vote for Hillary.

    But nooooooooooooooo. Now we have to read endless drivel about how you didn't help get Trump in no, no way...musta been the rest of the libs via democrats. Couldn't be the conservative neo-progressive Bernie on and off supporters.
    This has fuck all to do with Bernie personally. It has to do with whether the Democrats will recommit to working people and progressive ideas.

    For me, anyway.

  4. #64
    Chaos in fourteen lines Minotaur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    This has fuck all to do with Bernie personally. It has to do with whether the Democrats will recommit to working people and progressive ideas.

    For me, anyway.
    I understand that but your poll states Bernie supporters support him, Democrats don't. That is a predictable condition in a crazy election year where some lose all perspective. Which is why I posted what I posted that is the "f" it has to do with Bernie and my answer did not say it was Bernie I was talking about. It is his supporters. I have nothing against Bernie as I suspect he is a good guy who incidentally fails to get things done in his years in Congress but who is a lot better than Trump and the Russians who would have eaten him alive. Unlike some Bernie supporters I would have voted for him in a heartbeat to avoid causing so many people from suffering. I believed what Trump said he'd do. I'm a realist. The takeaway here should be to never do this to our country again. not to justify the unthinkable concept of voting for anyone but Hillary just because. Ideally voters get it together and are able to sort out the damage they have done simply for pie in the sky idealism guaranteed to fail. It always does. None of this was new.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minotaur View Post
    Voters either want it and show it with their votes or they don't want it and show it with their votes. If the last election was an indication, not only do they not want universal healthcare still but they also want to be punished like children by electing the worse candidate ever seen to accomplish that. I'm not sure voters realize how important they are when they run off on pipe dreams in spite of the reality. THEY are the ones responsible for exactly what they voted into office whether they stayed home, voted third party or voted Trump.

    You are correct though that now is the worse time to even pretend universal care is possible. Not sure these people understand how hard it was to get the ACA passed that could eventually lead to universal in some form. In too many minds these things can happen just because they want it. Then they vote like what they want is to undo any advances. It is a barnyard I tell ya. lol
    A lot of people want nothing to do with single payer and will resent being forced into funding it. Proponents of single payer are basically telling those citizens "Fuck off, we own you".

  6. #66
    Thought Provocateur NightSwimmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoom View Post
    A lot of people want nothing to do with single payer and will resent being forced into funding it. Proponents of single payer are basically telling those citizens "Fuck off, we own you".
    I guess that's one way of saying, "We're citizens of the same community."

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by NightSwimmer View Post
    I guess that's one way of saying, "We're citizens of the same community."
    When a portion of that community basically tells another "tough shit, you will do as we say", that's not so much a community as a majority rule dictatorship.

  8. #68
    Thought Provocateur NightSwimmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoom View Post
    When a portion of that community basically tells another "tough shit, you will do as we say", that's not so much a community as a majority rule dictatorship.
    That's what governments do. You are an anarchist.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NightSwimmer View Post
    That's what governments do. You are an anarchist.
    It's all a matter of degree. I strongly suspect we disagree on the scope of government, not on whether it should exist or not.

  10. #70
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minotaur View Post
    I understand that but your poll states Bernie supporters support him, Democrats don't. That is a predictable condition in a crazy election year where some lose all perspective. Which is why I posted what I posted that is the "f" it has to do with Bernie and my answer did not say it was Bernie I was talking about. It is his supporters. I have nothing against Bernie as I suspect he is a good guy who incidentally fails to get things done in his years in Congress but who is a lot better than Trump and the Russians who would have eaten him alive. Unlike some Bernie supporters I would have voted for him in a heartbeat to avoid causing so many people from suffering. I believed what Trump said he'd do. I'm a realist. The takeaway here should be to never do this to our country again. not to justify the unthinkable concept of voting for anyone but Hillary just because. Ideally voters get it together and are able to sort out the damage they have done simply for pie in the sky idealism guaranteed to fail. It always does. None of this was new.
    Anyone But Hillary voters weren't wrong.

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