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Thread: Portland OR Mayor "Cancels Trump Rally" Over Unrest Fears

  1. #61
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TNVolunteer73 View Post
    You do understand that Fascism is a Socialist Ideology right?

    What side of the political spectrum does socialism represent.

    The Fascist parties of the 1930s

    Opposed Private firearm ownership, Pushed gun control
    Promoted a Government Retirement System
    Promoted Government Managed/run healthcare
    Promoted progressive Personal income taxes
    Promoted the Regulation of Prices, and Wages
    Promoted a minimum Garranteed income
    Promoted Government Run School system
    promoted Government sharing in the profits corporations earn
    Promoted progressive Corporate taxes.

    Are the principles Left or Right Wing?
    At their extremes, both fascism and communism devolve into anarchy and thus, the "political spectrum" is actually a circle.

    But fuck no, fascism is not a "leftist" philosophy.

    You are welcome to start a new thread If you wish to lose this debate to me at greater length.

    Lolol.

    Just ping me, if you do, and I will join you.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by DebateDrone View Post
    There is no ban on free speech rally. Hysteria averted.
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/aclu-oreg...201324929.html

    The mayor of Portland, Oregon, has made an “unconstitutional” attempt to shut down upcoming rallies against sharia and in support of President Donald Trump, according to the ACLU of Oregon.

  3. #63
    You just made the list! Macduff's Avatar
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    “hate speech is not protected by the First Amendment,”
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.8985df7ff547

    Ok. Ted Wheeler is one of those idiots.
    Thanks from Madeline

  4. #64
    Veteran Member DebateDrone's Avatar
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    What does your link have to do with my post. The ACLU doesn't get to determine what is and is not unconstitutional. The Courts do that.

    No action has been taken...and the mayor of Portland says none will be. Case closed.

  5. #65
    Veteran Member aboutenough's Avatar
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    After Violent Attack, Portland Mayor Calls for Abandoning First Amendment

    The mayor of Portland, Oregon, has strong words for those who would sow fear in his city and attempt to shut down citizens' rights to free expression: "I surrender."
    On Friday, two men were stabbed to death on a train in Portland while confronting and trying to calm down a man who was allegedly loudly harassing two young women with anti-Muslim comments.
    Mayor Ted Wheeler's response to this brutal attack was to essentially tell the world that violence can successfully be used to convince the government to shut down civil liberties. In a rather self-absorbed speech Monday that treats this horrible but isolated event as though it were some sort of mass slaughter deserving of a permanent monument and some sort of "leadership" by politicians, Wheeler is demanding that the federal government cancel the permits for a couple of upcoming "alt-right" rallies in Terry Schrunk Plaza.

    He flat out said in his comments that the city would refuse to grant rally permits to alt-right groups based on their views. However, the plaza right by Portland City Hall is actually federal property, and Wheeler is trying to get federal authorities to revoke the permits for the groups involved in a pair of June events.
    And while there's some gesturing toward the idea that he wants the city to have time to grieve, he wouldn't be making such demands if the stabber had been yelling just incoherent nonsense and not an anti-Muslim rant. That's because Wheeler makes it very abundantly clear that he believes the people organizing these rallies are bigots and he doesn't want them around. He's using this violence as a way of curtailing the First Amendment right to both peacefully assemble and engage in free speech.
    In response to those who point out that the alt=right has the same First Amendment protections as the rest of us, Wheeler actually says, "Hate speech is not protected by the First Amendment of the Constitution." (It's at about 6:54 in this clip of his comments


    There is no "hate speech" exemption to the First Amendment, and it's bad enough when poorly educated college students believe that there is. We don't need politicians who run cities reinforcing the idea that such speech is not protected, because it feeds the idea that violent protests against certain speakers is therefore some form of heroic rebellion. He reinforces the mentality that threats, and even just fears, of violent responses are acceptable reasons to prohibit public protests.
    This excuse is used by authoritarian regimes everywhere as a mechanism of suppressing speech. Once you send the message that violence will be used as a pretext to shut down the expression of certain opinions, violence is exactly what you'll get. Turkish authoritarian President Recep Erdogan claims that anybody speaking out against him is part of a violent plot to remove him in order to justify using government violence back against the critics.


    Fortunately the American Civil Liberties Union's chapter in Oregon is tweeting back at the mayor, warning him that attempting to shut down rallies on the basis of disagreeing with the content is literally what the First Amendment is meant to prevent:


    Follow

    ACLU of Oregon
    @ACLU_OR


    1. The government cannot revoke or deny a permit based on the viewpoint of the demonstrators. Period. https://twitter.com/tedwheeler/status/869257231576965120 …
    1:35 PM - 29 May 2017




    After Violent Attack, Portland Mayor Calls for Abandoning First Amendment - Hit & Run : Reason.com
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.99f7f1f36fdb

    Do you believe the mayor has the right to deny permits for rallies because his disagree's with their message? Looks like he is going with this idea. Free Speech cannot be stopped according to the ACLU. Are they wrong to?

  6. #66
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    As EUtopia goes, so goes America's leftists.

  7. #67
    the "good" prag pragmatic's Avatar
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    Gonna give the mayor a pass on this one. Pretty horrific event he is reacting to. He is responding to the violence element.

    If the groups want to sue the city they probably have a good chance of winning.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by pragmatic View Post
    Gonna give the mayor a pass on this one. Pretty horrific event he is reacting to. He is responding to the violence element.

    If the groups want to sue the city they probably have a good chance of winning.
    There's never any excuse for exploiting the horrific actions of one scumbag to revoke 1A rights of citizens who don't share your worldviews.

    collective punishment for the acts of one is the type of petty, paternalistic bullshit I'd expect to see in North Korea....or bootcamp.

  9. #69
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    I guess a few of these fat loud mouth white bigots want to gather and shout their rascit non sense.....Fvck 'em

  10. #70
    Veteran Member Panzareta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aboutenough View Post
    The mayor of Portland, Oregon, has strong words for those who would sow fear in his city and attempt to shut down citizens' rights to free expression: "I surrender."
    On Friday, two men were stabbed to death on a train in Portland while confronting and trying to calm down a man who was allegedly loudly harassing two young women with anti-Muslim comments.
    Mayor Ted Wheeler's response to this brutal attack was to essentially tell the world that violence can successfully be used to convince the government to shut down civil liberties. In a rather self-absorbed speech Monday that treats this horrible but isolated event as though it were some sort of mass slaughter deserving of a permanent monument and some sort of "leadership" by politicians, Wheeler is demanding that the federal government cancel the permits for a couple of upcoming "alt-right" rallies in Terry Schrunk Plaza.

    He flat out said in his comments that the city would refuse to grant rally permits to alt-right groups based on their views. However, the plaza right by Portland City Hall is actually federal property, and Wheeler is trying to get federal authorities to revoke the permits for the groups involved in a pair of June events.
    And while there's some gesturing toward the idea that he wants the city to have time to grieve, he wouldn't be making such demands if the stabber had been yelling just incoherent nonsense and not an anti-Muslim rant. That's because Wheeler makes it very abundantly clear that he believes the people organizing these rallies are bigots and he doesn't want them around. He's using this violence as a way of curtailing the First Amendment right to both peacefully assemble and engage in free speech.
    In response to those who point out that the alt=right has the same First Amendment protections as the rest of us, Wheeler actually says, "Hate speech is not protected by the First Amendment of the Constitution." (It's at about 6:54 in this clip of his comments


    There is no "hate speech" exemption to the First Amendment, and it's bad enough when poorly educated college students believe that there is. We don't need politicians who run cities reinforcing the idea that such speech is not protected, because it feeds the idea that violent protests against certain speakers is therefore some form of heroic rebellion. He reinforces the mentality that threats, and even just fears, of violent responses are acceptable reasons to prohibit public protests.
    This excuse is used by authoritarian regimes everywhere as a mechanism of suppressing speech. Once you send the message that violence will be used as a pretext to shut down the expression of certain opinions, violence is exactly what you'll get. Turkish authoritarian President Recep Erdogan claims that anybody speaking out against him is part of a violent plot to remove him in order to justify using government violence back against the critics.


    Fortunately the American Civil Liberties Union's chapter in Oregon is tweeting back at the mayor, warning him that attempting to shut down rallies on the basis of disagreeing with the content is literally what the First Amendment is meant to prevent:


    Follow

    ACLU of Oregon
    @ACLU_OR


    1. The government cannot revoke or deny a permit based on the viewpoint of the demonstrators. Period. https://twitter.com/tedwheeler/status/869257231576965120 …
    1:35 PM - 29 May 2017




    After Violent Attack, Portland Mayor Calls for Abandoning First Amendment - Hit & Run : Reason.com
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.99f7f1f36fdb

    Do you believe the mayor has the right to deny permits for rallies because his disagree's with their message? Looks like he is going with this idea. Free Speech cannot be stopped according to the ACLU. Are they wrong to?
    It is ironic seeing a Portland Mayor taking the Reagan approach.

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