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Thread: who decides when a person is an "illegal"?

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by the watchman View Post
    murder isn't illegal? Molesting a child isn't illegal? Committing a terrorist act isn't illegal?
    All are illegal. However, those committing those acts are labelled by the nature of their acts. The act of entering our country not in compliance with our laws or entering illegally is the act for which they are labelled.
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  2. #32
    "Mr. Original". the watchman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheWahoo View Post
    All are illegal. However, those committing those acts are labelled by the nature of their acts. The act of entering our country not in compliance with our laws or entering illegally is the act for which they are labelled.
    all crimes are committed illegally.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by the watchman View Post
    Who decided it was a suitable shortcut? It certainly wasn't the court.
    The Court did not address what counted as "appropriate language," which was not at issue in the case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by the watchman View Post
    oh, ok. So, what if they do respect this country but came here to , say, escape persecution? Ya know, like the people that founded this country? Or, to escaped brutal dictatorships? What of kids that were born here, or brought by their parents? And are you aware that labeling people, themselves, as being "illegals" is what the Nazi's did?
    Doesn't matter. We have rules in place now.
    Nazis also ate and drank. I bet you do too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    The Court did not address what counted as "appropriate language," which was not at issue in the case.
    Justice Sotamayor is said to have softened the language around the immigration debate. I'll have to go back and look at the case again. I may have gotten them confused.

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    Quote Originally Posted by One View Post
    Doesn't matter. We have rules in place now.
    Nazis also ate and drank. I bet you do too.
    that's a really stupid argument.

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    Quote Originally Posted by the watchman View Post
    that's a really stupid argument.
    Same as yours. You just don't seem to like it turned back on you.;

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by One View Post
    Same as yours. You just don't seem to like it turned back on you.;
    another stupid argument. I didn't suggest we should discount anything the Nazi's did because they're essentially human beings , that eat and drink, just like the rest of us. You did. What exactly was that "turned back on" me about? My argument was that they used various means to deny the humanity of their victims. Including, labeling them as being "illegal people". Don't take my word for it though.

    It was Elie Wiesel that said ...“You who are so-called illegal aliens must know that no human being is illegal.”
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by the watchman View Post
    another stupid argument. I didn't suggest we should discount anything the Nazi's did because they're essentially human beings , that eat and drink, just like the rest of us. You did. What exactly was that "turned back on" me about? My argument was that they used various means to deny the humanity of their victims. Including, labeling them as being "illegal people". Don't take my word for it though.

    It was Elie Wiesel that said ...“You who are so-called illegal aliens must know that no human being is illegal.”

    Ok, we have Godwin out of the way.
    Anyhow, my grandparents migrated toi the US at the dawn of the 20th century. They had to follow the rules to gain citizenship here. I expect others who come here to be bound by the same rules. Knowingly coming here through illegal means shows a disregard for the US laws for entry to the country. You are free to label them as you want, but that won't change their status as illegal aliens.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by the watchman View Post
    oh, ok. So, what if they do respect this country but came here to , say, escape persecution? Ya know, like the people that founded this country? Or, to escaped brutal dictatorships? What of kids that were born here, or brought by their parents? And are you aware that labeling people, themselves, as being "illegals" is what the Nazi's did?
    It seems that you found the need to apply Godwin's Law, which is typically a measure of last resort to promote a point. In the instances that you mention, our immigration laws provide the ability to request asylum. However, it is the responsibility of those wishing to enter to make such a request. They can do so at a US Embassy or Consulate or upon entry they can present themselves to the proper immigration authorities and make such a request. If they make such a request and it is granted, then I would submit that they have not entered illegally and would agree that they should not be labelled, underscore labelled, as an illegal. Any child born in this country is a citizen and therefore should not be labelled as an illegal. Regarding, those children that entered via the illegal actions of their parents, I have always stated that they should be given specific consideration because they had no control over the illegal act of their parents. Moreover, specific provisions have been made available to them, but again, it is their responsibility to apply for those provisions.

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