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Thread: South Carolina lawmakers introduce bill to begin secession debate

  1. #51
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DebateDrone View Post
    A] Where in the US Constitution or in the SC ruling Texas v White does either state that revolution is a lawful act?
    "The union between Texas and the other States was as complete, as perpetual, and as indissoluble as the union between the original States. There was no place for reconsideration or revocation, except through revolution or through consent of the States." Texas v. White, 74 U.S. 700, 726 (1869) (emphasis supplied).

    Quote Originally Posted by DebateDrone View Post
    B] Where in Texas v White does it opine that there is a lawful way in the US Constitution for a state to leave the union other that to say ...with consent of the states.
    That is, unfortunately, all it says. It does not say whether by majority of, supermajority of, or unanimity of the states. Any of those options is hypothetically reasonable, the way the opinion is written.

    Quote Originally Posted by DebateDrone View Post
    The only way the states can give consent is by constitutional method is amending the Constitution to allow it.
    As a practical matter, "the states" (whatever that might means) could probably consent in any way they want consistent with White.

  2. #52
    Veteran Member ptif219's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    Nor are you conservatives, whether Republican or right-wingnut or any other version. This country is roughly half-and-half. Your incessant attacks on Democrats, liberals and anyone else you do not like - just like your messiah, Trump - merely demonstrate you put politics above country based on the hatred you never stop articulating.
    Once again you are wrong. The independents are the biggest percent

  3. #53
    Veteran Member Michael J's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptif219 View Post
    If democrats think gun owners are just going let guns be confiscated they are in for big surprise. Gun owners will fight to keep their guns and their constitutional rights.

    https://www.washingtontimes.com/news...ced-over-gun-/
    I wonder how high America's literacy rate would be without the Palmetto State.

  4. #54
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptif219 View Post
    Once again you are wrong. The independents are the biggest percent.
    No, they are not. First of all:

    Overall, 48% of all registered voters identify as Democrats or lean Democratic compared with 44% who identify as Republican or lean toward the GOP.
    Party affiliation among U.S. voters: 1992-2016 | Pew Research Center

    48% + 44% = 92%. That leaves only 8% to be apportioned amongst other parties - including, e.g., the Green Party, the Constitution Party, and Independent (i.e., unaffiliated).

    Thus, it is you who is wrong.

    Besides, people who like to call themselves "independents" tend to keep voting the same way they did before, which means they are still Democrat, Republican, or whatever other affiliation they maintained before. While remaining technically unaffiliated by virtue of registration, there is no practical difference if they continue voting consistently with their previous affiliation. Furthermore, states with open or semi-open primaries allow them to vote in the same primary.

    Thus, calling oneself "independent" in many cases is not particularly meaningful, even apart from the fact that no more than 8% would self-identify as such anyway.

  5. #55
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael J View Post
    I wonder how high America's literacy rate would be without the Palmetto State.
    https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/...-by-state.html

    Using this data, South Carolina is 41st in high school graduates, 38th in bachelor's degrees, and 36th in advanced degrees. Not last, but in the bottom half either way.

    (I spreadsheeted the data, so I can show it whichever way and report the results. If anyone wants, I can print to PDF and upload.)

  6. #56
    Veteran Member ptif219's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    No, they are not. First of all:


    Party affiliation among U.S. voters: 1992-2016 | Pew Research Center

    48% + 44% = 92%. That leaves only 8% to be apportioned amongst other parties - including, e.g., the Green Party, the Constitution Party, and Independent (i.e., unaffiliated).

    Thus, it is you who is wrong.

    Besides, people who like to call themselves "independents" tend to keep voting the same way they did before, which means they are still Democrat, Republican, or whatever other affiliation they maintained before. While remaining technically unaffiliated by virtue of registration, there is no practical difference if they continue voting consistently with their previous affiliation. Furthermore, states with open or semi-open primaries allow them to vote in the same primary.

    Thus, calling oneself "independent" in many cases is not particularly meaningful, even apart from the fact that no more than 8% would self-identify as such anyway.
    As always you are wrong

    Party Affiliation | Gallup Historical Trends

  7. #57
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly5 View Post


    Which one is Roy Moore?
    Roy Moore has received MANY death threats from crazed liberals and atheist Marxists, and so he has had to hire many body doubles, brave individuals who take enormous risks by pretending to be Roy Moore while out in public. These are only a few of those courageous individuals. America should be applauding them!
    Thanks from Hollywood

  8. #58
    Dick with my Buzz...Try DebateDrone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    "The union between Texas and the other States was as complete, as perpetual, and as indissoluble as the union between the original States. There was no place for reconsideration or revocation, except through revolution or through consent of the States." Texas v. White, 74 U.S. 700, 726 (1869) (emphasis supplied).


    That is, unfortunately, all it says. It does not say whether by majority of, supermajority of, or unanimity of the states. Any of those options is hypothetically reasonable, the way the opinion is written.


    As a practical matter, "the states" (whatever that might means) could probably consent in any way they want consistent with White.


    Texas v White gives no method or direction or indication on how that consent would be given...so the Constitution's methods trump White's suggestion.

    Amendment or Constitutional convention are the only way ...written down in which the states give consent.

    In any case... South Carolina, as well as all the other states, would have come up to the state's process by which the states would give consent for a state to leave the union.

    A process would have to be agreed on by the states even before a state could ask to secede.

    Even getting the states to participate in the formation of a process would be like herding black cats on a moonless night.

  9. #59
    THE PUNDIT DemoWhip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John T Ford View Post
    You do realize California is talking succession too, right?

    And, last I checked California was not considered part of the south.

    You guys ignorance of any given topic is entertaining if nothing else.
    California is part of the WEST. The SOUTH ends with Louisiana. Next comes the SOUTHWEST which includes Texas, Colorado, New Mexico, Utah, Nevada and Arizona.

  10. #60
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptif219 View Post
    As always you are wrong.
    Give it a rest, troll. You probably read neither link.

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