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Thread: A sudden realization

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sassy View Post
    And your hate for Trump will go away when he leaves office? We will see.
    Opps .....

    I'd be careful.

    Exposing hypocrisy can get you in trouble.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blueneck View Post
    Republicans knew Hillary was running again as early as 2012 and they used the next for years to have hearings every time she so much as farted.

    Maybe this time you're being led to believe she or Biden will run to keep the real candidates from being subject to the world's longest crucifixion.

    Stranger things have happened.
    I'm not being "led to believe" anything.

    I'm telling the forum what the 24/7 "news" media is talking about this morning.

    They said Hillary may be running again in 2020.

    They even have her campaign slogan: "Third time is the charm".

    My suggestion would be: "A two time loser, what could possibly go wrong?".
    Thanks from John T Ford

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miller47 View Post
    I'm not being "led to believe" anything.

    I'm telling the forum what the 24/7 "news" media is talking about this morning.

    They said Hillary may be running again in 2020.

    They even have her campaign slogan: "Third time is the charm".

    My suggestion would be: "A two time loser, what could possibly go wrong?".
    Current events can be confusing.

  4. #14
    Junior Member Havelock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDBoop View Post
    This won't even end when Hillary is dead. The hate will continue. How do I know this? Ted Kennedy.

    What is with the people who can't let go of the past, especially when it hasn't even had any actual effect on them or their lives?

    It's not sane. It's not normal. It most assuredly isn't healthy. This is an obsession that is harming no one but the one who hates.
    Two points: Okay, maybe three…

    First, while it’s true that all politicians invite their supporters to condemn “the bad guys” in an effort to gin up greater enthusiasm and to paint themselves as virtuous and sympathetic by contrast, the Republicans have over the last 40-50 years come to rely on this technique more and more heavily. It has really taken off since Bill Clinton, in their eyes, “stole” George H.W. Bush’s second term and Newt Gringrich took over the House with his “raze the city and rule the ruins” philosophy. Hillary was associated with Bill Clinton’s “illegitimate” presidency, of course; a lot of conservatives saw her at the time as an overly-ambitious, insufficiently demure “feminist” harpy. Thus, we hear incessantly about her “baggage.” That dates back to the ‘90s, eh?

    Then of course she actually became a successful politician in her own right. That just confirmed all of the negative feelings that a core group of Republicans already had about her. So, as a presidential candidate she started off with a history and a deep reservoir of animosity among a party that offers little these days apart from anger, jeremiads, appeals to tribal instincts, and empty promises of simple fixes to complex problems that never seem to require any significant work or sacrifice on the part of “real Americans.”

    Second, as Blueneck pointed out above, the Republicans knew for approximately eight years – and certainly for four years – that Hillary was the likely Democratic nominee in 2016. So, for years they focused all of their efforts on painting her as corrupt, incompetent, careless, unhealthy, uncaring, snobbish, grasping, greedy, shrewish, debauched, unwomanly, ugly, you name it… Remember how Benghazi was all Obama’s fault at first? How he supposedly was watching the video of the events unfolding and ordered rescue forces to “stand down...?” How he ordered Susan Rice to lie about the video...? All of that went away as soon as the election was over and then Benghazi was all Hillary Clinton’s fault – and we had to have Congressional hearing after hearing about it for the next three years. The residual effects of a negative PR campaign such as that is going to linger for a while no matter what.

    By the way, yes, it was stupid of Hillary to set up that private email server; and despite her protests it seems likely that she knew what she was doing and it was at least as much about having and keeping control of her electronic correspondence as it was about convenience. She was her own worst enemy in that instance and it probably cost her the Presidency. Whether it should have is another question. We know after an investigation that she wasn’t negligent or careless with classified materials, no more so than previous Secretaries of State in any case. She shouldn’t have done it, and the evolution of technology made that a lot clearer in 2016 than it was even in 2008. But no real harm came of it. And if you’ve been relentlessly smeared in one way or another for a couple of decades, well, maybe that makes your desire to keep your cards as close to your vest as possible a bit more understandable.

    And of course now we see many of the same people who though Hillary should be doing hard time in the federal penn for putting state secrets at risk pooh poohing Donald Trumps illegal use of a private cell phone for official communications. So no, it was never really about state security, was it?

    Finally, critically, in order to stick with the tribe and vote for someone as plainly and dangerously incompetent and unsuitable as Donald Trump for President, a good many voters had to truly believe that Hillary was the evil she-beast that the Republican propaganda made her out to be. As Trump’s administration flounders, these folks need to double down on Hillary hate in order to keep convincing themselves that they only did what they had to do. We are seeing this a lot on this very forum, no?

    So, unfortunately, we can expect to hear a lot more talk over the next two to six years about how horrible Hillary was and about how so many people felt there was really no choice but to vote for Trump and about how therefore Trump’s failures are really all the fault of the Democratic party for failing to nominate a decent candidate in 2016.

    Cheers.

  5. #15
    Veteran Member Dangermouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John T Ford View Post
    Some people's sins, like Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, etc. follow them beyond the grave.

    Hillary Clinton, is arguably one of the most divisive and corrupt politicians in modern American history.

    Of course folks will be discussing her corrupt dealings for decades to come.
    No. Trump will fit that list, with his petty venality and corruption visible for all to see. Hillary's "crimes" are imaginary.
    Thanks from labrea and Panzareta

  6. #16
    Junior Member 5 stringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havelock View Post
    Two points: Okay, maybe three…

    First, while it’s true that all politicians invite their supporters to condemn “the bad guys” in an effort to gin up greater enthusiasm and to paint themselves as virtuous and sympathetic by contrast, the Republicans have over the last 40-50 years come to rely on this technique more and more heavily. It has really taken off since Bill Clinton, in their eyes, “stole” George H.W. Bush’s second term and Newt Gringrich took over the House with his “raze the city and rule the ruins” philosophy. Hillary was associated with Bill Clinton’s “illegitimate” presidency, of course; a lot of conservatives saw her at the time as an overly-ambitious, insufficiently demure “feminist” harpy. Thus, we hear incessantly about her “baggage.” That dates back to the ‘90s, eh?

    Then of course she actually became a successful politician in her own right. That just confirmed all of the negative feelings that a core group of Republicans already had about her. So, as a presidential candidate she started off with a history and a deep reservoir of animosity among a party that offers little these days apart from anger, jeremiads, appeals to tribal instincts, and empty promises of simple fixes to complex problems that never seem to require any significant work or sacrifice on the part of “real Americans.”

    Second, as Blueneck pointed out above, the Republicans knew for approximately eight years – and certainly for four years – that Hillary was the likely Democratic nominee in 2016. So, for years they focused all of their efforts on painting her as corrupt, incompetent, careless, unhealthy, uncaring, snobbish, grasping, greedy, shrewish, debauched, unwomanly, ugly, you name it… Remember how Benghazi was all Obama’s fault at first? How he supposedly was watching the video of the events unfolding and ordered rescue forces to “stand down...?” How he ordered Susan Rice to lie about the video...? All of that went away as soon as the election was over and then Benghazi was all Hillary Clinton’s fault – and we had to have Congressional hearing after hearing about it for the next three years. The residual effects of a negative PR campaign such as that is going to linger for a while no matter what.

    By the way, yes, it was stupid of Hillary to set up that private email server; and despite her protests it seems likely that she knew what she was doing and it was at least as much about having and keeping control of her electronic correspondence as it was about convenience. She was her own worst enemy in that instance and it probably cost her the Presidency. Whether it should have is another question. We know after an investigation that she wasn’t negligent or careless with classified materials, no more so than previous Secretaries of State in any case. She shouldn’t have done it, and the evolution of technology made that a lot clearer in 2016 than it was even in 2008. But no real harm came of it. And if you’ve been relentlessly smeared in one way or another for a couple of decades, well, maybe that makes your desire to keep your cards as close to your vest as possible a bit more understandable.

    And of course now we see many of the same people who though Hillary should be doing hard time in the federal penn for putting state secrets at risk pooh poohing Donald Trumps illegal use of a private cell phone for official communications. So no, it was never really about state security, was it?

    Finally, critically, in order to stick with the tribe and vote for someone as plainly and dangerously incompetent and unsuitable as Donald Trump for President, a good many voters had to truly believe that Hillary was the evil she-beast that the Republican propaganda made her out to be. As Trump’s administration flounders, these folks need to double down on Hillary hate in order to keep convincing themselves that they only did what they had to do. We are seeing this a lot on this very forum, no?

    So, unfortunately, we can expect to hear a lot more talk over the next two to six years about how horrible Hillary was and about how so many people felt there was really no choice but to vote for Trump and about how therefore Trump’s failures are really all the fault of the Democratic party for failing to nominate a decent candidate in 2016.

    Cheers.
    Yeah, Trump is a failure. You know that isn't true, but keep saying it. That's all you have.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dangermouse View Post
    No. Trump will fit that list, with his petty venality and corruption visible for all to see. Hillary's "crimes" are imaginary.
    LMAO @ "imaginary"

  8. #18
    Wawa Skittletits BDBoop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havelock View Post
    Two points: Okay, maybe three…

    First, while it’s true that all politicians invite their supporters to condemn “the bad guys” in an effort to gin up greater enthusiasm and to paint themselves as virtuous and sympathetic by contrast, the Republicans have over the last 40-50 years come to rely on this technique more and more heavily. It has really taken off since Bill Clinton, in their eyes, “stole” George H.W. Bush’s second term and Newt Gringrich took over the House with his “raze the city and rule the ruins” philosophy. Hillary was associated with Bill Clinton’s “illegitimate” presidency, of course; a lot of conservatives saw her at the time as an overly-ambitious, insufficiently demure “feminist” harpy. Thus, we hear incessantly about her “baggage.” That dates back to the ‘90s, eh?

    Then of course she actually became a successful politician in her own right. That just confirmed all of the negative feelings that a core group of Republicans already had about her. So, as a presidential candidate she started off with a history and a deep reservoir of animosity among a party that offers little these days apart from anger, jeremiads, appeals to tribal instincts, and empty promises of simple fixes to complex problems that never seem to require any significant work or sacrifice on the part of “real Americans.”

    Second, as Blueneck pointed out above, the Republicans knew for approximately eight years – and certainly for four years – that Hillary was the likely Democratic nominee in 2016. So, for years they focused all of their efforts on painting her as corrupt, incompetent, careless, unhealthy, uncaring, snobbish, grasping, greedy, shrewish, debauched, unwomanly, ugly, you name it… Remember how Benghazi was all Obama’s fault at first? How he supposedly was watching the video of the events unfolding and ordered rescue forces to “stand down...?” How he ordered Susan Rice to lie about the video...? All of that went away as soon as the election was over and then Benghazi was all Hillary Clinton’s fault – and we had to have Congressional hearing after hearing about it for the next three years. The residual effects of a negative PR campaign such as that is going to linger for a while no matter what.

    By the way, yes, it was stupid of Hillary to set up that private email server; and despite her protests it seems likely that she knew what she was doing and it was at least as much about having and keeping control of her electronic correspondence as it was about convenience. She was her own worst enemy in that instance and it probably cost her the Presidency. Whether it should have is another question. We know after an investigation that she wasn’t negligent or careless with classified materials, no more so than previous Secretaries of State in any case. She shouldn’t have done it, and the evolution of technology made that a lot clearer in 2016 than it was even in 2008. But no real harm came of it. And if you’ve been relentlessly smeared in one way or another for a couple of decades, well, maybe that makes your desire to keep your cards as close to your vest as possible a bit more understandable.

    And of course now we see many of the same people who though Hillary should be doing hard time in the federal penn for putting state secrets at risk pooh poohing Donald Trumps illegal use of a private cell phone for official communications. So no, it was never really about state security, was it?

    Finally, critically, in order to stick with the tribe and vote for someone as plainly and dangerously incompetent and unsuitable as Donald Trump for President, a good many voters had to truly believe that Hillary was the evil she-beast that the Republican propaganda made her out to be. As Trump’s administration flounders, these folks need to double down on Hillary hate in order to keep convincing themselves that they only did what they had to do. We are seeing this a lot on this very forum, no?

    So, unfortunately, we can expect to hear a lot more talk over the next two to six years about how horrible Hillary was and about how so many people felt there was really no choice but to vote for Trump and about how therefore Trump’s failures are really all the fault of the Democratic party for failing to nominate a decent candidate in 2016.

    Cheers.
    That all makes sense, and thank you for taking the time to write all that. But my actual question which may not have been as concise as it could have been was this: Why are they doing this to themselves? GWB & Co did a veritable shit-ton of damage, insane levels of damage. They never cross my mind or my keyboard. Because what would be the fucking point?

    These people are enmeshed with a woman who literally, as stated previously, will never affect their life, neither for good nor harm. Yet they can't go five posts without "But Hillary!"

    It's almost like a drug. Like they couldn't quit smoking or drinking, or gambling, or Hillary.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDBoop View Post
    That all makes sense, and thank you for taking the time to write all that. But my actual question which may not have been as concise as it could have been was this: Why are they doing this to themselves? GWB & Co did a veritable shit-ton of damage, insane levels of damage. They never cross my mind or my keyboard. Because what would be the fucking point?

    These people are enmeshed with a woman who literally, as stated previously, will never affect their life, neither for good nor harm. Yet they can't go five posts without "But Hillary!"

    It's almost like a drug. Like they couldn't quit smoking or drinking, or gambling, or Hillary.
    Allow me to explain it to you. Did you ever see "The Wizard of Oz"? What did the people do when they realized the wicked witch was dead? They rejoiced. That's what we're doing.
    Thanks from John T Ford

  10. #20
    Member Claudius the God's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDBoop View Post
    That all makes sense, and thank you for taking the time to write all that. But my actual question which may not have been as concise as it could have been was this: Why are they doing this to themselves? GWB & Co did a veritable shit-ton of damage, insane levels of damage. They never cross my mind or my keyboard. Because what would be the fucking point?

    These people are enmeshed with a woman who literally, as stated previously, will never affect their life, neither for good nor harm. Yet they can't go five posts without "But Hillary!"

    It's almost like a drug. Like they couldn't quit smoking or drinking, or gambling, or Hillary.
    Because it works and they have nothing else to run on. If their supporters actually understood issues they would not vote for Republicans. But they don't, they just know Republicans are my tribe and its my tribe right or wrong. I have been watching the Vietnam series by Burns. It was "my country right or wrong" or "america, love it or leave it". One activist said it was about two competing views on patriotism. One said accept your government no matter what, the other said fix the wrongs and focus on the right things. That type of argument is exactly what we are going through today only focused on issues created by right wing media and complicit donors. The real agenda is to use the government to take money from all of us and give it to the very few, that is what 40 years of conservative dogma finally succeeded in doing, raping us, our nation and the world so a small number of us can have 2 billion instead of 1 billion. They sell it by bait and switch tactics, Jesus loves zygotes, black people are going to kill you and take your money, Mexicans are raping your daughters, liberals are communists.
    Thanks from BDBoop, Panzareta and labrea

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