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Thread: what do the citizens want?

  1. #41
    Shut up and vote Addiction Solitaire Champion, Double Deuce Champion, Queen Jewels Champion, Ray Ray Shuffle Champion, Twins Champion, Blow Up: Arcade Champion, Bunch - Time Trial Champion, Znax Champion, Zoo Keeper Champion, Sobics School Champion, Swap a Smiley Champion, Makos Champion, Dino Drop Champion, Flower Frenzy Champion, Some Puzzle Champion, Funny Bubbles Champion, CubeZ Champion, Dinky Smash Champion, Fun Fun Animals Champion, Fruit Fabriek Champion, Raft Wars Champion, Rainbow Monkey RunDown Champion, Raft Wars Champion, Crime Puzzle Champion Blueneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonehead View Post
    can't disagree with that. but is that part of your top three?
    I'm not liking this being limited to three.

  2. #42
    Junior Member Slartibartfast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonehead View Post
    that would be one of mine, also.
    I had a friend who became a University Lecturer in the UK. The Universities receive a payment from the government for each student and a further payment on their qualification. Students pay towards this via student loans that you only repay if your wage is above a certain amount.

    This is because, the government wanted everyone to have access to degrees. So my friend wanted to kick off the course those who were not suitable and were going to fail. But because of the funding, he had to give them extra work and scrape them through their degree.

    Now you have graduates that are hopeless flooding the employment market. People are obtaining jobs that can only be filled by graduates and doing a piss poor job whilst those with life skills are not 'qualified' to apply and do a better job.

    Same in colleges, kids are given the answers during tests for them to pass. Passing and student retention created income to the college.

  3. #43
    Veteran Member bonehead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blueneck View Post
    I'm not liking this being limited to three.
    understand. but, let's just say three would be more than enough to keep congress busy for four years.
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  4. #44
    Veteran Member bonehead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slartibartfast View Post
    I had a friend who became a University Lecturer in the UK. The Universities receive a payment from the government for each student and a further payment on their qualification. Students pay towards this via student loans that you only repay if your wage is above a certain amount.

    This is because, the government wanted everyone to have access to degrees. So my friend wanted to kick off the course those who were not suitable and were going to fail. But because of the funding, he had to give them extra work and scrape them through their degree.

    Now you have graduates that are hopeless flooding the employment market. People are obtaining jobs that can only be filled by graduates and doing a piss poor job whilst those with life skills are not 'qualified' to apply and do a better job.

    Same in colleges, kids are given the answers during tests for them to pass. Passing and student retention created income to the college.
    I understand. that's why I stipulated qualified applicants and extended the idea to tech and trade schools.

  5. #45
    Shut up and vote Addiction Solitaire Champion, Double Deuce Champion, Queen Jewels Champion, Ray Ray Shuffle Champion, Twins Champion, Blow Up: Arcade Champion, Bunch - Time Trial Champion, Znax Champion, Zoo Keeper Champion, Sobics School Champion, Swap a Smiley Champion, Makos Champion, Dino Drop Champion, Flower Frenzy Champion, Some Puzzle Champion, Funny Bubbles Champion, CubeZ Champion, Dinky Smash Champion, Fun Fun Animals Champion, Fruit Fabriek Champion, Raft Wars Champion, Rainbow Monkey RunDown Champion, Raft Wars Champion, Crime Puzzle Champion Blueneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slartibartfast View Post
    I had a friend who became a University Lecturer in the UK. The Universities receive a payment from the government for each student and a further payment on their qualification. Students pay towards this via student loans that you only repay if your wage is above a certain amount.

    This is because, the government wanted everyone to have access to degrees. So my friend wanted to kick off the course those who were not suitable and were going to fail. But because of the funding, he had to give them extra work and scrape them through their degree.

    Now you have graduates that are hopeless flooding the employment market. People are obtaining jobs that can only be filled by graduates and doing a piss poor job whilst those with life skills are not 'qualified' to apply and do a better job.

    Same in colleges, kids are given the answers during tests for them to pass. Passing and student retention created income to the college.
    Don't we have the same problem with a system where the wealthy can get their kids into the best colleges?

  6. #46
    Veteran Member bonehead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blueneck View Post
    Don't we have the same problem with a system where the wealthy can get their kids into the best colleges?
    I might add the following to your comment "regardless of their qualifications".
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  7. #47
    Veteran Member bonehead's Avatar
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    well, at this point it appears education and healthcare are two most popular. I am somewhat disappointed - and surprised - that we have not heard from members of the right with some suggestions. this is really not intended to be a partisan political thread. this is about the citizens and, at my last recollection, those on the right are citizens as well as all others.
    Last edited by bonehead; 30th June 2018 at 04:13 AM.

  8. #48
    Anarquistador StanStill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HayJenn View Post
    The problem I have with "free" college education is that a lot of kids drop out of college before their 4 years is up. I would much prefer that we address the huge student debt problem.
    Well that would have to happen hand in hand with eliminating college tuition. No one should be saddled with $80,000 debt to a school that no longer charges tuition, just like no one should be serving time in prison or have a criminal record for possession of a drug that is no longer illegal.

    I don't see why people dropping out of college is a problem that should stop us, though. People drop out already with a small mountain of debt. I don't have a problem with there being standards of acceptance to college either. If someone barely scraped by getting out of high school, maybe college isn't the right next step. Maybe a year or two off to work before reevaluating if/why to go to college, and apply then. Maybe trade school or community college (already tuition free in Tennessee if I'm not mistaken).

    But you're right. We can't get rid of tuition until we figure a way to dig everyone out of the college debt they have. We need to do both.

  9. #49
    Anarquistador StanStill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Throttle View Post
    Elementary education is a foundation, but college is the end game, so there's a difference.
    If college degrees were as ubiquitous as high school diplomas they'd be worth as little to employers who would then discriminate between candidates by demanding advanced degrees. Furthermore, if government makes plenty of money available for tuition guess what happens to the cost of higher education? Well it's already happening, and now we've got short sighted people who want to make college even more expensive?
    Just because they are different doesn't mean that we should stop funding education for people who are succeeding. And your argument that we shouldn't fund college education because then a degree won't be special is nonsense. Do you really think the cost of education at elite private schools will go up when tuition at state schools drops to zero? Or course not. Furthermore, public funding of state schools isn't going up, so why is tuition skyrocketing? We should be able to see skyrocketing public moneys going into higher education that is causing the tuition boom, but it's not there.

    Also, lots of other countries have little to no tuition for colleges, and they don't see the problems you name. Why not? Why aren't college degrees worthless in England or France or Germany?

  10. #50
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    I would start by stopping the use of base line budgeting and use some form of zero based budgeting for governmental appropriations. The need for expenditures must be more than that's what was spent last year.

    While I would agree that there must be a health care safety net for all, that does not require a government operated single payer system. If one can provide for themselves they should be allowed to do so and why should taxpayers finance them.

    I agree that professional education should be available for all, but that does not mean college for all; it would include technical schools and apprenticeship programs. Taxpayer funded education should be limited to those needed skilled professions. Taxpayers should not fund some liberal arts program where students study door knobs and write papers on the sex life of door knobs.

    I agree that social programs are needed, but we should stop throwing good money after bad, the answer to our concerns is not to just throw more money at them. We need to evaluate our programs to insure that they are achieving the desired results, end and replace when necessary or amend. We need programs that will get people out of poverty, not merely subsidize poverty.

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