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Thread: Robo-Lawyers

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    That's a philosophy question. Cain kills Able. Is it murder?

    Was Cain mentally ill? Did Able provoke him? Was there a surprise death from what Cain intended only as an assault?

    Etc.
    Did Able have an eggshell skull?
    Thanks from Madeline

  2. #32
    Radical Centrist BigLeRoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    Actually, lawyers are in the dispute resolution business. We attempt to deliver the best justice possible for our clients, not the respective opposing parties.
    An awful lot of disputes going on in the world these days. You lawyer fellas must be very, VERY busy.

  3. #33
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLeRoy View Post
    An awful lot of disputes going on in the world these days. You lawyer fellas must be very, VERY busy.
    Alas, not everyone can pay.
    Thanks from Ian Jeffrey

  4. #34
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Throttle View Post
    I disagree; it isn't the verdict that makes someone a criminal, it's their actions.
    The verdict establishes that they are criminals as a matter of law. That means you cannot treat a person as a criminal unless convicted, and must treat them as innocent until otherwise determined.

    Furthermore, it is not merely their actions that make up death penalty crimes, but also the culpable mental state, causation and the social harm. If one of those is missing, you cannot establish the crime. For example:

    A is standing on railroad tracks. B fires a bullet at A. A is then struck by a train and killed. For the crime of murder, B has committed the actus reus - i.e., the physical act; and had the culpable mental state, or mens rea (here, "intent"); and the social harm (A's death) occurred; however, causation is lacking, since it was the train rather than the bullet that killed A. Therefore, B is not guilty of murder.

    Another example:

    A is crossing the street at the crosswalk with a "Walk" sign. B is driving perpendicular to A's path and has a red light. B's brakes fail, and he strikes and kills A. For the crime of murder, B has committed the actus reus; the social harm (A's death) occurred; and there was causation, in that B's physical act led directly to A's death. However, B had no intent to kill; rather, his brakes failed, and therefore he is not guilty of murder.

    Thus, it is not merely a person's actions that make someone a criminal, but a combination of factors.

    Finally, as stated earlier, society cannot treat a person as a criminal unless that person has been found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, where the state has proven every element of the crime beyond a reasonable doubt. A person is innocent until proven guilty, and therefore must be treated that way. If the person has been found not guilty, he is not - as a matter of law - a criminal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Throttle View Post
    And attorneys help guilty people go free every day.
    Since they are innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, after due process, this is false as a matter of law.

    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Throttle View Post
    As to businesses, if there's an imbalance in the quality of legal representation I'm pretty sure someone is getting screwed.
    You are guessing and stating - as in your other statements - nothing more than an ideological position.
    Thanks from Madeline

  5. #35
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otto Throttle View Post
    Did Able have an eggshell skull?
    Why would it matter?

  6. #36
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLeRoy View Post
    An awful lot of disputes going on in the world these days. You lawyer fellas must be very, VERY busy.
    Not as busy as I would like to be. As Madeline says, not everyone can pay.

  7. #37
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Sometimes, the status of the victim makes a killing death qualified. Murder of a child and murder of a cop in the line of duty are two common types.

  8. #38
    Spock of Vulcan Ian Jeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    Sometimes, the status of the victim makes a killing death qualified. Murder of a child and murder of a cop in the line of duty are two common types.
    You sure you posted this in the right thread? The DP thread is different than this one.

  9. #39
    Veteran Member Madeline's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Jeffrey View Post
    You sure you posted this in the right thread? The DP thread is different than this one.
    Whoops! This is the robot thread.

    My apologies.
    Thanks from Ian Jeffrey

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