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Thread: Is European Freedom Of Speech Better Than American?

  1. #91
    Wrinkly Member Dangermouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.Knuckles View Post
    Open the news for any day over the past 100 years and someone, somewhere, was openly criticizing the RCMP or the military. If not a dairy farmer, then a native Indian, or a quebec separatist, or an opposition critic.


    The radical difference being there’s not a nuclear outrage if a black man does it.

    Quebec separatism is another fair point. The ultimate test of free speech - the absolute ultimate test of it - is the allowance of separatist political parties and activists.

    There are hundreds of thousands of people here who have publically, openly, and passionately advocated for separation and independence every day of their lives. They have an official political party at both levels of government, and they work in the federal government, the military, and the RCMP without prejudice.

    They’ve had two referendums with no interference.

    The UK has Scottish separatists as well.

    You want to talk about free speech?
    Wait a minute! The Scottish separatists are running the bloody country! She's a proper she-devil is First Minister Nicola Sturgeon.
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  2. #92
    Wrinkly Member Dangermouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madeline View Post
    I don't understand the link between sports and patriotism. How did we collectively decide that the opening of every game is our shared, sacred space for announcing our love of country?
    We have anthems before internationals (edited highlights of both anthems) It used to be played in cinemas and theatres at the end of the performance, but the noise of people leaving drowned it out, and patriots would get trampled, so they gave up.
    It gets weird when the home nations play each other. England uses the British national anthem, God Save the Queen, but the other British nations use their own. Flower of Scotland, Land of my Fathers (Wales) and Northern Ireland the Londonderry Air.
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  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by galatin View Post
    You know in a debate there is always a temptation to argue with individual cases to make a point. But what you need also to look at is where mutatiosn in our societies lead us and it is not the question of one individual but of many. How many people do you need tomake a trend. We have exactly the same problem with minors, your umA, in Switzerland but I know some who after arriving at 15 here are now studying in universities and others who deal drug. The real question is how many people can we integrate every year in our societies ? Is das Boot voll ?
    Let me say it in this way: How high do you think is Switzerland able to build the Alps? Your "full boat" anti-question is totally irrelevant to anything what I said. But I can fill this anti-question with the idea "Worst case scenario": World economy breaks totally down - Switzerland is not able any longer to import and export any goods. What will happen? Is Switzerland able to defend the own country - and is it also able to near all people of Switzerland by keeping an intact nature too? What about solidarity? What about the temperatures in winter and so on and so on ... A "the boat will never be full"-hypothesis is much more idiotic, isn't it?

    And I am by the way not convinced it is good for Switzerland that people who were saved from Switzerland, so they had not do die, are dealing with drugs now in Switzerland and/or Europe or anywhere else in the world. I am not able to understand your calculation "students" vs "drug crimes". How many students justify how many drug crimes - how many drug crimes justify how many students? Which form to think is this? A Swiss form to think? For sure not. That's absurde - and I would say Swiss people are very concrete and not absurde. Who deals with drugs has to go where he came from and has to go there into prison. Every criminal "refugee" is a problem for every real refugee, who needs really help - specially children and women (surprisingly a minority of the refugees).

    Last edited by zaangalewa; 14th November 2017 at 11:38 PM.

  4. #94
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    You seem to ignore that it is very often impossible to send back people from where they come from. But what differs from your approach to mine comes from the fact that you build your reasoning on individual cases just to avoid to look at what is globally happening. How to apprehend the whole case if you limit yourself to what makes the headlines of the medias to feed your resoning ? And typically you do not catch nuances, when you pretend to start a reasoning on the opposition of the university student and the drug dealer. In what I was mentioning as a reaction to your post was that among underage refuges you find the best and now and then the worse. And you need a worse case scenario to make a point, when even during WWII Switzerland survived even though it could only feed 70% of its population and was surrounded by Axis powers. My father even if it was a standby spent 1000 days over that period in the army...... to wait for the Germans to comeand fortunately they didn't !

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by galatin View Post
    You seem to ignore
    I ignore intentionally nothing.

    that it is very often impossible to send back people from where they come from.
    It's not any problem to bring anyone at any place in the world. We are living in the 3rd millennium. An airplane - a catapult seat with parachute - and that's it. Okay - perhaps we would need a German aircraft carrier too. But we have allies with aircraft carriers.

    But what differs from your approach to mine comes from the fact that you build your reasoning on individual cases
    Asylum is an individual human right - not a right of mass migration.

    just to avoid to look at what is globally happening.
    Yesterday for example three mice used my presence to flee, so a hawk was not able to notice their existence. What the same second had happened all over the world I was not able to notice.

    How to apprehend the whole case if you limit yourself
    Why do you think I limit myselve?

    to what makes the headlines of the medias to feed your resoning ?
    Ah you are practicing an English form of anti-communication ala "Let's produce a war of words and who is tired to play this idiotic game is a loser."

    And typically you do not catch nuances, when you pretend to start a reasoning on the opposition of the university student and the drug dealer. In what I was mentioning as a reaction to your post was that among underage refuges you find the best and now and then the worse. And you need a worse case scenario to make a point, when even during WWII Switzerland survived even though it could only feed 70% of its population and was surrounded by Axis powers.
    What a nonsense. Switzerland was not in war with Germany and Italy - and even in this case Germans and Italians and French people had found ways to make trades in the Alps.

    My father even if it was a standby spent 1000 days over that period in the army...... to wait for the Germans to comeand fortunately they didn't !
    Sure they didn't. Why to attack Switzerland? But one reason not to attack Switzerland was for sure your daddy - and his comrades. It would had been a waste of time and material to try to do so. This was even clear for the most stupid Nazis. Unfortunately this was not clear for them in case of Russia or the USA.

    Last edited by zaangalewa; 15th November 2017 at 12:57 AM.

  6. #96
    Veteran Member Dr.Knuckles's Avatar
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    I always assumed that the anthem before hockey games was to remind the players and city fans that were all on the same side here in reality - abd not to murder each other.

    You know - just to remind me that they may be Maple Leafs fans, but theyíre still Canadians with civil liberties and legal rights. So I canít just curb stomp them because itís fun.
    Thanks from Dangermouse

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