‘There was no attempted coup’: FBI’s former top lawyer defends Russia probe

May 2013
16,372
15,065
Boise, ID
#91
I have no issue with the IG auditing the Russian Investigation. As for the 2 (or possibly 3) additional investigations...they seem politically motivated, so that smacks of a solution in search of a problem.

However, if the IG comes up short of Trump's intended goal and we still can't "Lock Her Up" -- what then? I have no doubt the divisive rhetoric won't be squelched one itty bitty bit. Which just makes this another pointless exercise in dumassery.

Plus, wasn't there some mention of wasting gov't monies on frivolous investigations?
Is Barr shopping for the best person to give him the result his boss wants?

Meh. Doesn't matter. Reality is whatever Trump says it is. I accept that. Resistance to alt-facts is futile.
Yep, the "dumassery" (great word - to describe the Orange Clown - I normally say dumbfuckery ;-) will continue even after they again .. find - - - > NOTHING. :rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
Likes: DairyHeiress
Sep 2017
5,245
6,304
Massachusetts
#94
This doesnt make sense.
Exactly my point. The whole argument here is that the bleating from the Trumpsters about this being an attempted coup is ridiculous.

A) no, that's not proven.
It's been proven beyond any reasonable doubt.

B) you're mixing the legitimate and illegal methods as the same.
No. I'm referring specifically to the illegal collusion of agents of the Russian government with a US political campaign.

Wrong, it's a lack of evidence
No. As you're well aware, there's no lack of evidence. We even have smoking-gun emails -- for example, the infamous communications between Trump Jr. and Russian agents about getting assistance from the Russian government in the campaign. Although that was obviously more than enough to justify impeachment and removal from office, that would require some appreciable portion of Republicans in the Senate to value our nation's principles, and we both know that was never going to happen.

That was the cover story, it had more to do with selling missile secrets to China
What would make you imagine that?
 
Jun 2013
17,626
15,180
Here
#98
We'll see, won't we?

The Mueller Report turned out to be a nothing burger, so his tax returns are the next big hope?

If that fizzles out, what's Plan C?
Nothing burger?

"Mueller's investigation is done. Here are the 34 people he indicted along the way"
Mueller's investigation is done. Here are the 34 people he indicted along the way


Mueller referred 14 potential crimes for investigation
Mueller referred 14 potential crimes for investigation


10 times Trump might have obstructed justice
10 times Trump might have obstructed justice



Mueller's scope/purview
https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-release/file/967231/download
28 CFR § 600.4 - Jurisdiction.

Criminal indictment/prosecution of a sitting President, versus impeachment

Can a sitting U.S. president face criminal charges?

WHAT IS THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT POLICY?
"In 1973, in the midst of the Watergate scandal engulfing President Richard Nixon, the Justice Department’s Office of Legal Counsel adopted in an internal memo the position that a sitting president cannot be indicted. Nixon resigned in 1974, with the House of Representatives moving toward impeaching him."

“The spectacle of an indicted president still trying to serve as Chief Executive boggles the imagination,” the memo stated."

"The department reaffirmed the policy in a 2000 memo, saying court decisions in the intervening years had not changed its conclusion that a sitting president is “constitutionally immune” from indictment and criminal prosecution. It concluded that criminal charges against a president would “violate the constitutional separation of powers” delineating the authority of the executive, legislative and judicial branches of the U.S. government."

"The 1973 and 2000 memos are binding on Justice Department employees, including Mueller, according to many legal experts. Mueller was appointed in May 2017 by the department’s No. 2 official Rod Rosenstein."
Can a sitting U.S. president face criminal charges? - Reuters


Hundreds of ex-prosecutors claim Trump would have been indicted if not president
Hundreds of ex-prosecutors claim Trump would have been indicted if not president


Ex-prosecutors: Trump would’ve been charged if not president
Ex-prosecutors: Trump would've been charged if not president

The Mueller Report Was My Tipping Point
I was a Trump transition staffer, and I’ve seen enough. It’s time for impeachment.
I Was a Trump Transition Staffer, and I’ve Seen Enough. It’s Time for Impeachment.



To Impeach a President: Applying the Authoritative Guide from Charles Black
Black’s point is that given the structure of the impeachment provision—providing that the president shall be impeached for “Treason, Bribery, or other High Crimes and Misdemeanors”—the last category must refer to the same “kind” of offenses as “treason” and “bribery.” He interprets this to mean that the offenses must (1) be “extremely serious,” (2) “in some way corrupt or subvert the political and governmental process,” and (3) be “plainly wrong in themselves to a person of honor, or to a good citizen, regardless of words on the statute books.”

"Note what Black does not include here—any suggestion that “high Crimes and Misdemeanors” must be, like treason and bribery, crimes. Instead he devotes significant energy to arguing the opposite. An impeachable offense need not be a crime—and a crime need not constitute an impeachable offense."
To Impeach a President: Applying the Authoritative Guide from Charles Black



Article I, Sec 2, Clause 5: The House of Representatives shall .have the sole power of impeachment.

Article I, Sec 3, Clauses 6-7: The Senate shall have the sole power to try all impeachments. When sitting for that purpose, they shall be on oath or affirmation. When the President of the United States is tried, the Chief Justice shall preside. And no person shall be convicted without the concurrence of two-thirds of the members present.
Judgment in cases of impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any office of honor, trust, or profit under the United States; but the party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to indictment, trial, judgment, and punishment according to law.


Article II, Sec 4: The President, Vice President, and all civil officers of the United States shall be removed from office on impeachment for, and conviction of, treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors.
The Impeachment Process





Considering Trump is still trying to go after Obama and Clinton, your contention is rather silly. When Trump's attempts to blame someone else for his own actions fail, what then?
 
Last edited:
Jul 2014
35,322
9,277
midwest
Nothing burger?

"Mueller's investigation is done. Here are the 34 people he indicted along the way"
Mueller's investigation is done. Here are the 34 people he indicted along the way


Mueller referred 14 potential crimes for investigation
Mueller referred 14 potential crimes for investigation


10 times Trump might have obstructed justice
10 times Trump might have obstructed justice



Mueller's scope/purview
https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-release/file/967231/download
28 CFR § 600.4 - Jurisdiction.

Criminal indictment/prosecution of a sitting President, versus impeachment

Can a sitting U.S. president face criminal charges?

WHAT IS THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT POLICY?
"In 1973, in the midst of the Watergate scandal engulfing President Richard Nixon, the Justice Department’s Office of Legal Counsel adopted in an internal memo the position that a sitting president cannot be indicted. Nixon resigned in 1974, with the House of Representatives moving toward impeaching him."

“The spectacle of an indicted president still trying to serve as Chief Executive boggles the imagination,” the memo stated."

"The department reaffirmed the policy in a 2000 memo, saying court decisions in the intervening years had not changed its conclusion that a sitting president is “constitutionally immune” from indictment and criminal prosecution. It concluded that criminal charges against a president would “violate the constitutional separation of powers” delineating the authority of the executive, legislative and judicial branches of the U.S. government."

"The 1973 and 2000 memos are binding on Justice Department employees, including Mueller, according to many legal experts. Mueller was appointed in May 2017 by the department’s No. 2 official Rod Rosenstein."
Can a sitting U.S. president face criminal charges? - Reuters


Hundreds of ex-prosecutors claim Trump would have been indicted if not president
Hundreds of ex-prosecutors claim Trump would have been indicted if not president


Ex-prosecutors: Trump would’ve been charged if not president
Ex-prosecutors: Trump would've been charged if not president

The Mueller Report Was My Tipping Point
I was a Trump transition staffer, and I’ve seen enough. It’s time for impeachment.
I Was a Trump Transition Staffer, and I’ve Seen Enough. It’s Time for Impeachment.


Black’s point is that given the structure of the impeachment provision—providing that the president shall be impeached for “Treason, Bribery, or other High Crimes and Misdemeanors”—the last category must refer to the same “kind” of offenses as “treason” and “bribery.” He interprets this to mean that the offenses must (1) be “extremely serious,” (2) “in some way corrupt or subvert the political and governmental process,” and (3) be “plainly wrong in themselves to a person of honor, or to a good citizen, regardless of words on the statute books.”

"Note what Black does not include here—any suggestion that “high Crimes and Misdemeanors” must be, like treason and bribery, crimes. Instead he devotes significant energy to arguing the opposite. An impeachable offense need not be a crime—and a crime need not constitute an impeachable offense."
To Impeach a President: Applying the Authoritative Guide from Charles Black
It was done to remove Trump from office.

It failed to deliver the desired result.

You want fries with that nothing burger?