APA: 'Traditional Masculinity' Is Harmful to Boys, Men

Jul 2013
1,245
1,654
U.S.A.
So, can any of you folks who believe that this study is “bullshit” produced by “partisan hacks” with a political agenda tell me when APA guidelines are and aren’t to be taken as Gospel?

I mean, at one time or another I’ve been told that APA guidance settle this or that question and we can rely on that because the APA has consistently held the same view for decades. At other times I’ve been told that the fact that the APA’s current judgments are trustworthy precisely because previous guidelines have been revised in light of new information. At still other times I’ve been informed that the APA is full of shit exactly because they changed their minds and issued new guidelines at some point in time.

Which category does this study fall into and, more importantly, how can we tell?

Because I gotta tell ya, from here it looks as if an awful lot of folks simply believe that the APA is a reliable authority when it reinforces their own feelings and that it’s populated by agenda-driven quacks when it challenges those feelings.

Cheers.
 
Oct 2013
24,046
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USA
But lets move this question from an attempted Dennis Miller one-liner to an intelligent question:

Which is more necessary for society: first responders (police, fire, soldiers) or artists?
Artist. Culture either mirrors or inspires the advancement of any society. As has been said before, the arts are the repository of society's collective memory.
 
Likes: Davocrat
Sep 2014
25,327
14,011
USA
So, can any of you folks who believe that this study is “bullshit” produced by “partisan hacks” with a political agenda tell me when APA guidelines are and aren’t to be taken as Gospel?

I mean, at one time or another I’ve been told that APA guidance settle this or that question and we can rely on that because the APA has consistently held the same view for decades. At other times I’ve been told that the fact that the APA’s current judgments are trustworthy precisely because previous guidelines have been revised in light of new information. At still other times I’ve been informed that the APA is full of shit exactly because they changed their minds and issued new guidelines at some point in time.

Which category does this study fall into and, more importantly, how can we tell?

Because I gotta tell ya, from here it looks as if an awful lot of folks simply believe that the APA is a reliable authority when it reinforces their own feelings and that it’s populated by agenda-driven quacks when it challenges those feelings.

Cheers.
I had to take a research class when I was in my Masters program. The Prof stated that stats and research can be manipulated in many ways to support a belief or agenda. He said to not believe every thing you read and there is nothing wrong with using experiential observation to help form your opinion and it was one of the greatest gifts to be old enough to compare. I personally have not seen males with toxic masculinity. What I have seen are douche bags. There is a difference between gender traits and douche bags.
 
Apr 2007
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Deep State
I had to take a research class when I was in my Masters program. The Prof stated that stats and research can be manipulated in many ways to support a belief or agenda. He said to not believe every thing you read and there is nothing wrong with using experiential observation to help form your opinion and it was one of the greatest gifts to be old enough to compare. I personally have not seen males with toxic masculinity. What I have seen are douche bags. There is a difference between gender traits and douche bags.
If we read the study posted by Blueneck above, we see it's not scary at all, nor anything like the simplified USA Today lede.

For example:

Screen Shot 2019-01-12 at 1.21.03 PM.png

So much of what psychologists advocate in the workplace is simply being adaptable, well rounded and agile. Clearly, this passage demonstrates that Mac's beloved "stoicism" trait is not bad in and of itself. The problem is, we might be raising boys to be that way all the time.

My own layman's extrapolation of this is that if you stuff your emotions all the time you might get cancer, or as suggested in the study, it can lead to poor human connectivity and relationships. Consider the suicide rate of men compared to women.
 
Jul 2011
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Toronto
Interesting discussion I just came upon (on a Russian sports forum).

It was about a hockey player from Russia, in the NHL, who just got suspended for a game over some incident, though he is reportedly back in the lineup now: Bobrovsky back with Blue Jackets after 'we cleared the air'

The (Russian newspaper) article being discussed mentioned that the team manager offered this guy, the player, to talk to their psychologist they they keep on staff, to help him with whatever issues he had. Which only pissed that one off and contributed to the problems between him and the management.

And, on the forum, some Russians were basically making fun that in America everyone runs to psychologists and psychiatrists for everything, that real men ain't supposed to be like that, should just be able to tough out anything life throws at you.

And another answered back: yeah, it's so much better here, in Russia. Here, we don't go to psychiatrists. In fact, here, a man cannot even talk about his issues like that, to anyone: he'd be mocked and ridiculed and spat on as a weakling. So, instead, men turn to drink and narcotics and abuse their wives. Yes, our society is SO much better...

Back in post #87, I talked about all the hardship and misery the "traditional masculinity" over there causes for women in Russia: APA: 'Traditional Masculinity' Is Harmful to Boys, Men

But, it is hurting the men too, as he says... :(