Was Jesus a real person?

Nov 2008
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4,432
Washington state
Your Xian blog is meaningless in interpreting anything to do with Judaism. Xianity does not get to say what Judaism is.

Because he was not, and that has been proven.
God does, not Jewish leaders. A few men in robes are not going to tell God and his prophets they were wrong. Every prophecy was fulfilled except the one where Jesus will come back to rule for a 1000 years


The Second Coming is when Jesus Christ will return to earth in fulfillment of His promises and to fulfill the prophecies made about Him. Jesus Himself promised, "At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory" (Matthew 24:30). Revelation 19:11-12 proclaims this about the Second Coming, "I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and makes war. His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself."

Those who witnessed Christ's ascension into heaven after his death and resurrection heard the angels declare in Acts 1:11, "Men of Galilee…why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven." The Second Coming is the literal return of Jesus Christ to earth as King in power and glory to rule for a thousand years (Revelation 20:1-6).
The Second Coming


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Dec 2014
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Then you believe the scriptures where the Messiah will be born from a virgin.
No, I never even implied such. That is what the texts state and a basic tenet of Christian dogma.

You think God screwed up, but the Messiah had to fulfill prophecy.
No, I don't think that at all. I don't believe God exists, and I have very good reason to believe the textual material is merely an invention in order for people to accept that he was the Messiah.

Through adoption Joseph became his earthly Father.
So, Joseph wasn't his father, as Caesar wasn't Octavian's. I knew that.

To solve the Jeconiah issue the line went to Nathan. Jeconiah was forgiven anyway and the curse ended.
How very convenient and rather tenuous. That again, is probably pure invention, as the two extant genealogies cannot even agree.
 
Jun 2014
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God does, not Jewish leaders. A few men in robes are not going to tell God and his prophets they were wrong. Every prophecy was fulfilled except the one where Jesus will come back to rule for a 1000 years


The Second Coming is when Jesus Christ will return to earth in fulfillment of His promises and to fulfill the prophecies made about Him. Jesus Himself promised, "At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory" (Matthew 24:30). Revelation 19:11-12 proclaims this about the Second Coming, "I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and makes war. His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself."

Those who witnessed Christ's ascension into heaven after his death and resurrection heard the angels declare in Acts 1:11, "Men of Galilee…why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven." The Second Coming is the literal return of Jesus Christ to earth as King in power and glory to rule for a thousand years (Revelation 20:1-6).
The Second Coming


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So, what happens after 1000 years? Does Jesus get bored with being King and abdicate the throne?
 

Ian Jeffrey

Council Hall
Mar 2013
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Vulcan, down the street from Darth Vader
Then you believe the scriptures where the Messiah will be born from a virgin.
One need not "believe" anything in order to identify what you believe.
Through adoption Joseph became [Jesus's] earthly Father.
You demonstrate your ignorance of Jewish law. "Adoption" does not change one's name or ancestry, and there is no provision in Jewish law for that. No matter what the relationship between a stepfather & stepson, the child's name does not change, and neither does his lineage.
To solve the Jeconiah issue the line went to Nathan.
There is no basis in the Tanakh for any such statement. The moshiach's descent must be through Solomon.
Jeconiah was forgiven anyway and the curse ended.
There is also no basis in the Tanakh for this statement, either.

In other words, you have just made an entire post of made-up things.
 
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Ian Jeffrey

Council Hall
Mar 2013
72,276
40,378
Vulcan, down the street from Darth Vader
G-d does, not Jewish leaders.
And G-d never said anything that you claim. There is no basis for anything you say in the Tanakh.
A few men in robes are not going to tell G-d and his prophets they were wrong.
I made no such claim. The prophets were not wrong. You are wrong about the connection between what they say and what you say.
Every prophecy was fulfilled except the one where Jesus will come back to rule for a 1000 years.
No, they were not - not even close. And there is no prophecy in the Tanakh - nor anything else in the Tanakh, for that matter - about Jesus in any way, shape or form. That is made up. And none of your "New Testament" quotes are relevant to anything in Judaism, as there is no basis for them in the Tanakh. You cannot use your "New Testament" to demonstrate (much less prove) anything about Judaism.
 
Nov 2008
60,616
4,432
Washington state
So, what happens after 1000 years? Does Jesus get bored with being King and abdicate the throne?
Notice what happens at the end of the Millennium: “When the thousand years are ended, Satan will be let loose from his prison, and he will come out to seduce the nations in the four quarters of the earth. He will muster them for war, the hosts of Gog and Magog, countless as the sands of the sea. They marched up over the breadth of the land and laid siege to the camp of God’s people and the city He loves. But fire came down on them from heaven and consumed them. Their seducer, the Devil, was flung into the lake of fire and sulfur …” (Revelation 20:7-10, REB).


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Feb 2010
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Notice what happens at the end of the Millennium: “When the thousand years are ended, Satan will be let loose from his prison, and he will come out to seduce the nations in the four quarters of the earth. He will muster them for war, the hosts of Gog and Magog, countless as the sands of the sea. They marched up over the breadth of the land and laid siege to the camp of God’s people and the city He loves. But fire came down on them from heaven and consumed them. Their seducer, the Devil, was flung into the lake of fire and sulfur …” (Revelation 20:7-10, REB).


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Trump goes to war in the ME?
 
Nov 2008
60,616
4,432
Washington state
And G-d never said anything that you claim. There is no basis for anything you say in the Tanakh.

I made no such claim. The prophets were not wrong. You are wrong about the connection between what they say and what you say.

No, they were not - not even close. And there is no prophecy in the Tanakh - nor anything else in the Tanakh, for that matter - about Jesus in any way, shape or form. That is made up. And none of your "New Testament" quotes are relevant to anything in Judaism, as there is no basis for them in the Tanakh. You cannot use your "New Testament" to demonstrate (much less prove) anything about Judaism.
As I said before what men in robes say will not change what God has done and will do. He has provided a Redeemer for the repentance of sins. He foretold this and it’s happening to this day.


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Sep 2012
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California
Here is my take on all prophecies:

Case A:

Person Z says X will happen in the future.
After some time, X happens.
People say the prophecy was fulfilled.
Same people now think everything person Z said about the future is correct and await fulfillment of next prophecy by person Z.

Analysis: Given enough time, most everything sooner or later occurs that are within the realm of reality. If I say "A butterfly will land on the South Pole" you might say this is absurd. But the South Pole was once a place where a butterfly could live so it could happen again given enough time. So if the prophecy is possible given our knowledge of reality, it may actually happen. Does this make the prophecy important to any of us? Nope.

Case B:

Person Z says future person X is the Son of God.
After some time, a person X runs around the world saying he is the Son of God.
People believe him despite no proof whatsoever that he is the Son of God.
Person Z's followers then proclaim the prophecy is correct and that the proof needed to prove person X is indeed the Son of God is the prophecy itself.
Prophecy is fulfilled.

Analysis: A prophecy can be used to prove anything if one cannot prove it in another fashion. The key is to ask yourself why you cannot prove it otherwise. The answer is that there is no evidence that you have fulfilled the prophecy at all but that some want to believe so bady they will find any historical statement as proof. This is how you fulfill a prophecy, just look back in history, find the prophecy you like and claim you fulfilled it. Jews do not buy into the stuff, neither do Muslims. Christians do though.
 
Nov 2008
60,616
4,432
Washington state
Here is my take on all prophecies:

Case A:

Person Z says X will happen in the future.
After some time, X happens.
People say the prophecy was fulfilled.
Same people now think everything person Z said about the future is correct and await fulfillment of next prophecy by person Z.

Analysis: Given enough time, most everything sooner or later occurs that are within the realm of reality. If I say "A butterfly will land on the South Pole" you might say this is absurd. But the South Pole was once a place where a butterfly could live so it could happen again given enough time. So if the prophecy is possible given our knowledge of reality, it may actually happen. Does this make the prophecy important to any of us? Nope.

Case B:

Person Z says future person X is the Son of God.
After some time, a person X runs around the world saying he is the Son of God.
People believe him despite no proof whatsoever that he is the Son of God.
Person Z's followers then proclaim the prophecy is correct and that the proof needed to prove person X is indeed the Son of God is the prophecy itself.
Prophecy is fulfilled.

Analysis: A prophecy can be used to prove anything if one cannot prove it in another fashion. The key is to ask yourself why you cannot prove it otherwise. The answer is that there is no evidence that you have fulfilled the prophecy at all but that some want to believe so bady they will find any historical statement as proof. This is how you fulfill a prophecy, just look back in history, find the prophecy you like and claim you fulfilled it. Jews do not buy into the stuff, neither do Muslims. Christians do though.
You really think a religion that kills people to please Allah is credible? Or Jew punished Jesus for healing a man that had been crippled for 30 years. Shall we congratulate the Muslims for murdering 1600 of our citizens on 9/11/2001?
Born in Bethlehem:-

Mic 5:2 But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. Ian will say, this didn’t happen


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