What if alternative energy isnt all its cracked up to be?

Mar 2012
58,026
39,582
New Hampshire
#1
Filmmaker Michael Moore has a new film coming out about this and how "in bed" the alternative energy industry is with fossil fuels.

What if alternative energy isn't all it's cracked up to be? That's the provocative question explored in the documentary "Planet of the Humans," which is backed and promoted by filmmaker Michael Moore and directed by one of his longtime collaborators.

Director Jeff Gibbs takes on electric cars, solar panels, windmills, biomass, biofuel, leading environmentalist groups like the Sierra Club, and even figures from Al Gore and Van Jones, who served as Barack Obama's special adviser for green jobs, to 350.org leader Bill McKibben, a leading environmentalist and advocate for grassroots climate change movements.

Gibbs didn't set out to take on the environmental movement. He said he wanted to know why things weren't getting better. But when he started pulling on the thread, he and Moore said they were shocked to find how inextricably entangled alternative energy is with coal and natural gas, since they say everything from wind turbines to electric car charging stations are tethered to the grid, and even how two of the Koch brothers — Charles and David — are tied to solar panel production through their glass production business.

"We all want to feel good about something like the electric car, but in the back of your head somewhere you've thought, 'Yeah, but where is the electricity coming from? And it's like, 'I don't want to think about that, I'm glad we have electric cars,'" Moore said.

Although the findings will be disheartening, both Gibbs and Moore say they hope that it inspires people to reset and start thinking differently.

"It turned out the wakeup call was about our own side," Gibbs said in a phone interview. "It was kind of crushing to discover that the things I believed in weren't real, first of all, and then to discover not only are the solar panels and wind turbines not going to save us ... but (also) that there is this whole dark side of the corporate money ... It dawned on me that these technologies were just another profit centre."

Both know the film is going to be a "tough pill to swallow." It was a difficult eye-opener for them as well.

New Michael Moore-backed doc tackles alternative energy
 
Likes: MichelleZ
Mar 2012
58,026
39,582
New Hampshire
#3
Well I dont think a lot of people understand how it all works and who owns the patents. "Big Oil" owns more than 70% of all solar patents. So they can afford to sit on them if they want. All the little manufacturers are also owned by organizations that might not fit what they assume. They are massively intertwined.
 
Mar 2019
1,700
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On a drive-by
#4
Well I dont think a lot of people understand how it all works and who owns the patents. "Big Oil" owns more than 70% of all solar patents. So they can afford to sit on them if they want. All the little manufacturers are also owned by organizations that might not fit what they assume. They are massively intertwined.

I was thinking more along the lines of how many toxic chemicals are used to create the panels.

The toxic chemicals in solar panels include cadmium telluride, copper indium selenide, cadmium gallium (di)selenide, copper indium gallium (di)selenide, hexafluoroethane, lead, and polyvinyl fluoride. Additionally, silicon tetrachloride, a byproduct of producing crystalline silicon, is highly toxic.

Toxic Chemicals in Solar Panels
 
Likes: WolfHulk
Nov 2015
7,193
2,424
UK
#5
Filmmaker Michael Moore has a new film coming out about this and how "in bed" the alternative energy industry is with fossil fuels.

What if alternative energy isn't all it's cracked up to be? That's the provocative question explored in the documentary "Planet of the Humans," which is backed and promoted by filmmaker Michael Moore and directed by one of his longtime collaborators.

Director Jeff Gibbs takes on electric cars, solar panels, windmills, biomass, biofuel, leading environmentalist groups like the Sierra Club, and even figures from Al Gore and Van Jones, who served as Barack Obama's special adviser for green jobs, to 350.org leader Bill McKibben, a leading environmentalist and advocate for grassroots climate change movements.

Gibbs didn't set out to take on the environmental movement. He said he wanted to know why things weren't getting better. But when he started pulling on the thread, he and Moore said they were shocked to find how inextricably entangled alternative energy is with coal and natural gas, since they say everything from wind turbines to electric car charging stations are tethered to the grid, and even how two of the Koch brothers — Charles and David — are tied to solar panel production through their glass production business.

"We all want to feel good about something like the electric car, but in the back of your head somewhere you've thought, 'Yeah, but where is the electricity coming from? And it's like, 'I don't want to think about that, I'm glad we have electric cars,'" Moore said.

Although the findings will be disheartening, both Gibbs and Moore say they hope that it inspires people to reset and start thinking differently.

"It turned out the wakeup call was about our own side," Gibbs said in a phone interview. "It was kind of crushing to discover that the things I believed in weren't real, first of all, and then to discover not only are the solar panels and wind turbines not going to save us ... but (also) that there is this whole dark side of the corporate money ... It dawned on me that these technologies were just another profit centre."

Both know the film is going to be a "tough pill to swallow." It was a difficult eye-opener for them as well.

New Michael Moore-backed doc tackles alternative energy
Renewables won't save the planet, nuclear will. Here's the chap that duped Obama and the happy clappers. He's now pro-nuclear. They never listen.

 
Mar 2012
58,026
39,582
New Hampshire
#6
I was thinking more along the lines of how many toxic chemicals are used to create the panels.

The toxic chemicals in solar panels include cadmium telluride, copper indium selenide, cadmium gallium (di)selenide, copper indium gallium (di)selenide, hexafluoroethane, lead, and polyvinyl fluoride. Additionally, silicon tetrachloride, a byproduct of producing crystalline silicon, is highly toxic.

Toxic Chemicals in Solar Panels
Several areas are now finding the chemicals from panels in their water supply. We have two towns here that now are temporarily banning the panels until they figure it out.
 
Jan 2018
917
954
The greatest place in America, California
#7
Solyndra was a new concept maker of panels that did not have any openings to allow anything to leak out or in. But China caused them to go bankrupt before they even began production.
 
Mar 2012
58,026
39,582
New Hampshire
#8
Solyndra was a new concept maker of panels that did not have any openings to allow anything to leak out or in. But China caused them to go bankrupt before they even began production.
As I recall Mobil Exxon bought up quite a few of Solyndra's patents after they went under.
 
Likes: BigBob

johnflesh

Former Staff
Feb 2007
27,277
20,010
.
#9
There is the economic side to this as well.

A good example is Elon Musk's Tesla vehicles. He makes all sorts of claims about the vehicles which are, pretty remarkable, as well as claims about gas-powered vehicles belonging in a museum. This save the world initiative comes at a great cost to consumers aside from 1 model, are unaffordable for typical car buyers. That alone has muddied the waters of saving any worlds.

I like Musk but I always try to remind him that most people don't buy $60,000 cars.
 
Likes: bajisima
Mar 2012
58,026
39,582
New Hampshire
#10
There is the economic side to this as well.

A good example is Elon Musk's Tesla vehicles. He makes all sorts of claims about the vehicles which are, pretty remarkable, as well as claims about gas-powered vehicles belonging in a museum. This save the world initiative comes at a great cost to consumers aside from 1 model, are unaffordable for typical car buyers. That alone has muddied the waters of saving any worlds.

I like Musk but I always try to remind him that most people don't buy $60,000 cars.
Also electric cars dont run on ether. They run on electricity which is derived from any type of source depending on where you live. If you live in an area where your electricity is derived from coal you are doing more harm than good. Or where natural gas is heavily fracked. I kid you not, we had a town hall meeting last year where they are trying to bring natural gas up to various parts of the state due to popular demand, and when the locals found out it was both a fossil fuel and had to come in via pipelines, they protested it and said they preferred coal. Cant win..
 

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